Will systems like Ram Air work with negative air machine

leofry

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Ok lets say you buy the ram air or a similar system to clean ducts and you want to step up your game can i assume ( i know your not suppose to assume) that you can work that system with a negative air machine... meaning you just now need to buy one piece of equipment ?
I had talked to a salesman from a company that said no you cant, i almost felt like he was just giving me that answer because he was not a believer in Ram air...


Thoughts ?
 

Scott W

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Ram Air, Air Wave and similar systems work by moving the air from the air handler out to the supply vents. They use air from the air handler to push and vacuum from the truckmount to pull air and debris out to the truck.

Most negative air systems attach to thetrunk line and pull air the opposite direction. So, the systems are not totally compatible.

Air whipes, brushes and some devices that are part of Ram Air, Air Wave and such can still be used with a negative air system. But they would be inserted and used in a different manner.
 

David Hart

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Good answer Scott.
I'd like to add that the RamAir and Air Wave systems work in the opposite direction of the "negative air" method, but still work on the same principle of agitation and air movement.
We're simply harnessing the power of the air handler (to which you could refer as "positive air movement") as opposed to turning the air handler off and hooking up a separate air movement system.
 

emeraldclean

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Good answer Scott.
I'd like to add that the RamAir and Air Wave systems work in the opposite direction of the "negative air" method, but still work on the same principle of agitation and air movement.
We're simply harnessing the power of the air handler (to which you could refer as "positive air movement") as opposed to turning the air handler off and hooking up a separate air movement system.
Sorry been cleaning ductwork for 20 yrs and we NEVER have turned on furnace fan/ airhandler while cleaning!!
In fact the power to the furnace is shut off at breaker panel.
Tell me how you don't disturb the debris inside the duct work and then send it through supply while cleaning returns when running airhandler please.
I use negative air equipment approx 10k CFM and scorpion rod system from Heatseal .
Oh and we also clean the main ductwork which makes up 75% of the entire ductwork.
We block off Supply/ Return at the furnace filter by inserting a piece of cardboard the size of furnace filter. Common filters up here are 20x20 20x25 and 16x25.
We also block off all offshoots with cardboard and leave one open on each supply and cold for airflow.
Again tell me how you don't pull debris that you disturbed through fan and into evaporator coil / heating elements and out the supply while cleaning the dirtiest part of the ductwork ( cold air returns) Already know you don't clean the mains .
 

David Hart

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Sorry been cleaning ductwork for 20 yrs and we NEVER have turned on furnace fan/ airhandler while cleaning!!
In fact the power to the furnace is shut off at breaker panel.
Tell me how you don't disturb the debris inside the duct work and then send it through supply while cleaning returns when running airhandler please.
I use negative air equipment approx 10k CFM and scorpion rod system from Heatseal .
Oh and we also clean the main ductwork which makes up 75% of the entire ductwork.
We block off Supply/ Return at the furnace filter by inserting a piece of cardboard the size of furnace filter. Common filters up here are 20x20 20x25 and 16x25.
We also block off all offshoots with cardboard and leave one open on each supply and cold for airflow.
Again tell me how you don't pull debris that you disturbed through fan and into evaporator coil / heating elements and out the supply while cleaning the dirtiest part of the ductwork ( cold air returns) Already know you don't clean the mains .

No apology needed!
Your question has merit and deserves a fantastic answer.

During the cleaning process, each supply duct is cleaned one at at time, with the vacuum box secured on the duct opening.
The vacuum is then attached to the vacuum box, pulling the debris in that direction, augmented by the air movement generated by the air handler.
Since you're cleaning one duct at a time, the disturbance (agitation) of debris is limited to that duct, not the others, so no dust/debris blows out elsewhere in the home.

It works extremely well, to which I can attest for having cleaned thousands of buildings personally, as well as hundreds of thousands of buildings cleaned by purchasers of the RamAir system.
A simple Google search of "RamAir Duct Cleaning" will reveal literally hundreds of websites of cleaners who clearly state on their site "We proudly use the RamAir system..." and such.

Oh, and we clean the main ductwork (in the industry we refer to that as the trunk line) as well.
I don't agree that the trunkline comprises 75% of the ductwork, but I'm not going to split hairs with you. lol

So before you make statements like "Already know you don't clean the mains", might wanna fact check first ; )
 

emeraldclean

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No apology needed!
Your question has merit and deserves a fantastic answer.

During the cleaning process, each supply duct is cleaned one at at time, with the vacuum box secured on the duct opening.
The vacuum is then attached to the vacuum box, pulling the debris in that direction, augmented by the air movement generated by the air handler.
Since you're cleaning one duct at a time, the disturbance (agitation) of debris is limited to that duct, not the others, so no dust/debris blows out elsewhere in the home.

It works extremely well, to which I can attest for having cleaned thousands of buildings personally, as well as hundreds of thousands of buildings cleaned by purchasers of the RamAir system.
A simple Google search of "RamAir Duct Cleaning" will reveal literally hundreds of websites of cleaners who clearly state on their site "We proudly use the RamAir system..." and such.

Oh, and we clean the main ductwork (in the industry we refer to that as the trunk line) as well.
I don't agree that the trunkline comprises 75% of the ductwork, but I'm not going to split hairs with you. lol

So before you make statements like "Already know you don't clean the mains", might wanna fact check first.
Still haven't talked about the cold air return brother!
This is the nasty part as it is before filter at furnace.
Please describe how you clean main ductwork or "Trunks"
Yes I have seen the ram air videos just shows cleaning a supply never a return or main .
I see how it ( Ram Air).would work on a supply vent that's about it.
Now again not needing to split hairs here but up my way ( we have different ductwork) the mains are large and run length of house.
Ram air is relatively inexpensive to purchase compared to a Caddy Vac or Pringle, Biltwel or Heatseal unit.
Show me a video of you cleaning main ductwork in a home , heck show me a video of you cleaning a cold air return!
The negative air is working against your system when running airhandler when trying to clean cold air return !
Grant
 
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David Hart

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Still haven't talked about the cold air return brother!
This is the nasty part as it is before filter at furnace.
Please describe how you clean main ductwork or "Trunks"
Yes I have seen the ram air videos just shows cleaning a supply never a return or main .
I see how it ( Ram Air).would work on a supply vent that's about it.
Now again not needing to split hairs here but up my way ( we have different ductwork) the mains are large and run length of house.
Ram air is relatively inexpensive to purchase compared to a Caddy Vac or Pringle, Biltwel or Heatseal unit.
Show me a video of you cleaning main ductwork in a home , heck show me a video of you cleaning a cold air return!
The negative air is working against your system when running airhandler when trying to clean cold air return !
Grant
Still haven't talked about the cold air return brother!
This is the nasty part as it is before filter at furnace.
Please describe how you clean main ductwork or "Trunks"
Yes I have seen the ram air videos just shows cleaning a supply never a return or main .
I see how it ( Ram Air).would work on a supply vent that's about it.
Now again not needing to split hairs here but up my way ( we have different ductwork) the mains are large and run length of house.
Ram air is relatively inexpensive to purchase compared to a Caddy Vac or Pringle, Biltwel or Heatseal unit.
Show me a video of you cleaning main ductwork in a home , heck show me a video of you cleaning a cold air return!
The negative air is working against your system when running airhandler when trying to clean cold air return !
Grant


You didn't ask about the cold air return... brother! lol
Just because you haven't seen our videos detailing how those parts of the system are cleaned does not mean we don't clean them... and, the videos are out there... right on YouTube.

The "negative air" (inaccurate industry term of which I'm not fond) does not work against the cleaning of the return duct.
Boy you like to make assumptions and pass it along as "the truth!"

With all due respect, I'm not going to sit here and type out the complete instructions on how ducts are cleaned.
If you're genuinely interested in how the revolutionary, world reknown RamAir system works, give me a call.
I'm happy to answer all your questions personally.

Cheers.
 

emeraldclean

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You didn't ask about the cold air return... brother! lol
Just because you haven't seen our videos detailing how those parts of the system are cleaned does not mean we don't clean them... and, the videos are out there... right on YouTube.

The "negative air" (inaccurate industry term of which I'm not fond) does not work against the cleaning of the return duct.
Boy you like to make assumptions and pass it along as "the truth!"

With all due respect, I'm not going to sit here and type out the complete instructions on how ducts are cleaned.
If you're genuinely interested in how the revolutionary, world reknown RamAir system works, give me a call.
I'm happy to answer all your questions personally.

Cheers.
Yes asked a few times about cold air but you dance around it. It is obvoius you don't clean them or the mains but feel free to shut me up with video.
You don't need to type out how ducts are cleaned because I actually clean them ( including cold air returns both mains , furnace fan and compartment AC coil and condensing unit).
Your system is a hit and miss at best and I would welcome you to bring it up my way and do your best in a house and then I will set up my equipment and show you and the homeowner what you left behind.
Hell I could pull off a cold air return after your Ramair job and take a flash light and inspection mirror and expose your system for what it is " Mickey Mouse"
Again feel free to post a video of return air cleaning and main ductwork please !
Your website just shows cleaning a simple supply off shoot.
Most homes these days use 3M filtrate filters and furnace A/C coil and supply stay very clean as the filter is so efficient. The cold air return on the other hand is before filter and that is were all the crap is .
I have forgot more than you will ever know about HVAC .and cleaning.
See I know what your revolutionary World reknown Ramair system is capable of cleaning and NOT cleaning.
Great make millions selling your system . Cleanco's IAQ , Rotobrush same goes for them.
 

David Hart

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Yes asked a few times about cold air but you dance around it. It is obvoius you don't clean them or the mains but feel free to shut me up with video.
You don't need to type out how ducts are cleaned because I actually clean them ( including cold air returns both mains , furnace fan and compartment AC coil and condensing unit).
Your system is a hit and miss at best and I would welcome you to bring it up my way and do your best in a house and then I will set up my equipment and show you and the homeowner what you left behind.
Hell I could pull off a cold air return after your Ramair job and take a flash light and inspection mirror and expose your system for what it is " Mickey Mouse"
Again feel free to post a video of return air cleaning and main ductwork please !
Your website just shows cleaning a simple supply off shoot.
Most homes these days use 3M filtrate filters and furnace A/C coil and supply stay very clean as the filter is so efficient. The cold air return on the other hand is before filter and that is were all the crap is .
I have forgot more than you will ever know about HVAC .and cleaning.
See I know what your revolutionary World reknown Ramair system is capable of cleaning and NOT cleaning.
Great make millions selling your system . Cleanco's IAQ , Rotobrush same goes for them.

Dude, I don't know if you have an attitude problem, or are perhaps just having a bad day.
I'm not going to continue this childish little tirade with you.
Guys like you who 'get their kicks' out of being douchebags behind the anonymity of a computer aren't worth my time.

Like I said, if you'd like to put on your big boy pants and give me a call, I'm more than happy to discuss with you how ductwork is properly cleaned.
I'm sure you do a fine job at it in your business, but you really ought to open your mind a little, and not act like a spoiled little kindergartner when it comes to discussing a system about which you really know nothing.

I have very little patience for ignorance, and even less for disrespectful people.

Get your last little stab in, then let's be done with it.
G'day ; )
 

emeraldclean

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Dude, I don't know if you have an attitude problem, or are perhaps just having a bad day.
I'm not going to continue this childish little tirade with you.
Guys like you who 'get their kicks' out of being douchebags behind the anonymity of a computer aren't worth my time.

Like I said, if you'd like to put on your big boy pants and give me a call, I'm more than happy to discuss with you how ductwork is properly cleaned.
I'm sure you do a fine job at it in your business, but you really ought to open your mind a little, and not act like a spoiled little kindergartner when it comes to discussing a system about which you really know nothing.

I have very little patience for ignorance, and even less for disrespectful people.

Get your last little stab in, then let's be done with it.
G'day ; )
Post a video of your Mickey Mouse system cleaning a cold air return buddy very simple!
I'm not hiding behind a computer screen in fact I'm very well known and respected on this sight.
Get calls and PM's all the time from members wanting to get into duct cleaning and wondering what equipment I use and suggest.
Again I like what your system can do for a simple supply off shoot but if your so proud of your dinky toy your flogging here post a video of it doing more than a hit and miss job like you have on your website.
Guys buying your system must have a hard time sleeping at night especially if they are leaving the homeowner with the impression that the whole ductwork was cleaned.
Not getting my kicks or being a douchbag but see you as an entrepreneur more than an innovator.
Again post or provide links of cold air return and "Trunks as you call them" being cleaned by RamAir
Here I am actually hooked up on cold air main and cleaning it properly

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emeraldclean

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You have a 5:46 video of RAM AIR duct cleaning training.
What a joke on cleaning cold air returns. You expect me to believe or anyone that understands HVAC that the filter grabs all the debris when you run airhandler and start using compressd air?
Guaranteed dust particles go through filter and now through furnace fan A\C coil and through supply into Mrs Smith house... can you say dust storm?? ( could just imagine how clogged that filter gets and you run the fan which would now be starving for air)
1:46 of the video you suggest tapeing shut off switch to keep fan on and take off furnace door while fan is running and start cleaning the blower and compartment!!
Were the hell does the debris go??? I know , through the heat exchangers , elements A/C coil and again into Mrs Smith house because you got the fan running and it's gotta blow it out the registers genius!! Again dust storm!!
Again please don't talk to me like I'm in kindergarten ( like you suggested I'm acting like) and insult my intelligence! You said I'm acting childish and know nothing about your system but your wrong I exposed it for what it is and can and cannot do.
Grant
 
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emeraldclean

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Well I'm going to the negative air machine..it's on order. If I'm gonna do it I'm gonna do it right ..thanks guys

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
John glad to hear you are doing things properly!
It was nice to talk to you in person a few weeks back.
As mentioned please don't hesitate to call me if you have any questions or concerns. Also would like some feedback on what you think of the equipment you chose.
I'm here for the members and my brothers .... not selling anything!
Kindest Regards
Grant
 
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danbrown20

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Grant,

How heavy is that duct hose you use? It definitely looks like a better and easier to use hose than the one I recently sold to run off of my gas powered neg air machine. I hated it so much that I sold it for an electric neg air unit so I could use a shorter (and lighter) mylar hose. Also, is that some sort of a grommet that you use to keep it attached to the trunk, or is it able to hang up there by itself due to the 10k cfm?
 

emeraldclean

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Grant,

How heavy is that duct hose you use? It definitely looks like a better and easier to use hose than the one I recently sold to run off of my gas powered neg air machine. I hated it so much that I sold it for an electric neg air unit so I could use a shorter (and lighter) mylar hose. Also, is that some sort of a grommet that you use to keep it attached to the trunk, or is it able to hang up there by itself due to the 10k cfm?
Dan the hose is fairly light and in 25 ft sections that accordion down to eight feet.
One person can easily carry a section .
I put one hand and arm into each end and pick up and go.
I had rigged hose in the past and got rid of it.
Black Knight hose from www.heatsealequipment.com is excellent.
Grant
 

David Hart

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You have a 5:46 video of RAM AIR duct cleaning training.
What a joke on cleaning cold air returns. You expect me to believe or anyone that understands HVAC that the filter grabs all the debris when you run airhandler and start using compressd air?
Guaranteed dust particles go through filter and now through furnace fan A\C coil and through supply into Mrs Smith house... can you say dust storm?? ( could just imagine how clogged that filter gets and you run the fan which would now be starving for air)
1:46 of the video you suggest tapeing shut off switch to keep fan on and take off furnace door while fan is running and start cleaning the blower and compartment!!
Were the hell does the debris go??? I know , through the heat exchangers , elements A/C coil and again into Mrs Smith house because you got the fan running and it's gotta blow it out the registers genius!! Again dust storm!!
Again please don't talk to me like I'm in kindergarten ( like you suggested I'm acting like) and insult my intelligence! You said I'm acting childish and know nothing about your system but your wrong I exposed it for what it is and can and cannot do.
Grant

Dude, why are you such a dick?
Ask rather than assume.
We have specially designed blasting balls and agitation whips that scour the inside of the ducts.
The "training video" to which you're referring is just a sample, not the training video that comes with the system.

Like I said, I'm sure you do a good job at cleaning ducts, but so do we.
I sure hope you treat people face to face more respectfully than you do from behind the anonymity of a computer.
 

emeraldclean

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Dude, why are you such a dick?
Ask rather than assume.
We have specially designed blasting balls and agitation whips that scour the inside of the ducts.
The "training video" to which you're referring is just a sample, not the training video that comes with the system.

Like I said, I'm sure you do a good job at cleaning ducts, but so do we.
I sure hope you treat people face to face more respectfully than you do from behind the anonymity of a computer.
I have a fantastic business and well respected in my community!
I'm very transparent on TMF.
Don't hide behind my computer,
Perhaps you will have a booth in Vegas this Sept and you can meet me in person and I will tell you were the bear shits in the buckwheat right to your face!
 

David Hart

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I have a fantastic business and well respected in my community!
I'm very transparent on TMF.
Don't hide behind my computer,
Perhaps you will have a booth in Vegas this Sept and you can meet me in person and I will tell you were the bear shits in the buckwheat right to your face!

I'll be in booth 918 at the Vegas Experience.
I can't wait to meet you. xo
 
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emeraldclean

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I'll be in booth 918 at the Vegas Experience.
I can't wait to meet you. xo
I will be there and we will see if you call me a douche bag to my face.
Your slick I'll give you that David!
Don't be red in the dick just because I'm calling balls and strikes .
Oh and after I school you we can go for beers!