Wicking problem from hell---Need help!! | TruckMount Forums #1 Carpet Cleaning Forums

Wicking problem from hell---Need help!!

psufan215

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Feb 21, 2011
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Bill Glinka
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I recently cleaned a 5 bedroom house that has Mohawk Smartstrand carpet. The customer told me from the initial phone call that according to the manufacturer she only wants me to use hot water extraction and NO chemicals. Despite what she said, I still used a small amount of Red Label Cherry Bomb in my hydroforce sprayer and Extracted the carpet with Prochem Fiber rinse in my solution feed. When I finished the carpets were very clean and the customer remarked at how nice the house smelled. The following day, the customer called me back to say that many of the "spots" that were on the floor had returned. I went back and this time I used a high ph cleaner followed by a chemspec rinse in my solution line and extracted the carpet again. I even used a water claw on one of the stains. I left my fans to help dry the carpet and the following day the customer called again. I went back and told the customer I was embarrassed and she said ---no worries---this happens every time I get the carpets cleaned. The companies always have to come back 2 or 3 times because the spots keep coming back. I told her that would have been some useful information she could have shared prior to my first visit. She also admitted to using resolve and hydrogen peroxide on the carpets many times trying to remove the stains.

This time I went back and decided to take her advise and simply used water to flood the carpet stains while using my water claw. Once again the carpets looked great and the next day she called again because this time not only did the spots return, but they were even bigger! I made a few phone calls, I visited my local distributor and was told the stains were coming back to due an unusual amount of residue that must be residing in the carpet padding. They told me the only solution was to use a browning agent or flood rinse the spots with Prochem All Fiber Rinse (powder). So once again I went back and this time I used a 5 gallon bucket of water with Prochem All Fiber rinse (powder) and a measuring cup simply to use as a means of pouring the solution on to the carpet while the subsurface tool was in place. I poured the solution on the carpet and flushed it over and over with the rinse solution. I used about 15 gallons of solution cleaning 7 spots on the carpet ( 2 areas which were about a foot and a half in circumference. The others were about the size of my hand. The carpet looked beautiful when I finished and one of the stains I used an entire 5 gallon bucket of the rinse solution to make sure there was no chance of that wicking occurring again and this time not only did I leave fans I also sprayed stain free on top of the carpet which is an oxidizing agent and I explained to the customer that I did everything I could and there is no reason these stains should wick back at this point. I left a few fans and was on my way.

Its only been a few hours and once again the customer has sent me a text indicating that the stains are once again coming back. I called my training rep and he still keeps implying that the problem is in the padding beneath the carpet. He says there is simply so much residue I just can't seem to get it out. I am just not sure at this point. Now I am wondering if her water could be the problem. Living in Florida we have hard water and I guess my question is could her water be causing the wicking problem or do you agree it simply is so much carpet cleaner and residue still left in the padding beneath the carpet. I feel like my only solution at this point is to use a encapsulation product or maybe Host to just clean the top surface of the carpet and not get that padding wet but for me that does not feel like it is resolving the problem because as soon as that carpet gets wet or cleaned again down the road these stains are going to rear their ugly head again.

Does anyone have any advice at this point? And in case your wondering what type of equipment I am using--I have a sapphire 370 truckmount. I attached a few pictures the customer has sent me. 2 of them are from the same area---one was taken this evening and the other was taken prior to todays cleaning.
 

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OxiFreshGuy

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Encap it. Mix your product with distilled water
 

mrotto

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Host will NOT help

me thinks the customer knows what caused this. she knew this was going to happen.

theres a thread about customers not telling the truth. This fits that description

the problem is that customers know other people like themselves, so shes going to tell everyone she knows that you were kind enough to come out multiple times to try to fix the problem and guess what? All her friends will expect the same thing.
 
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jtsunbrite

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I recently cleaned a 5 bedroom house that has Mohawk Smartstrand carpet. The customer told me from the initial phone call that according to the manufacturer she only wants me to use hot water extraction and NO chemicals. Despite what she said, I still used a small amount of Red Label Cherry Bomb in my hydroforce sprayer and Extracted the carpet with Prochem Fiber rinse in my solution feed. When I finished the carpets were very clean and the customer remarked at how nice the house smelled. The following day, the customer called me back to say that many of the "spots" that were on the floor had returned. I went back and this time I used a high ph cleaner followed by a chemspec rinse in my solution line and extracted the carpet again. I even used a water claw on one of the stains. I left my fans to help dry the carpet and the following day the customer called again. I went back and told the customer I was embarrassed and she said ---no worries---this happens every time I get the carpets cleaned. The companies always have to come back 2 or 3 times because the spots keep coming back. I told her that would have been some useful information she could have shared prior to my first visit. She also admitted to using resolve and hydrogen peroxide on the carpets many times trying to remove the stains.

This time I went back and decided to take her advise and simply used water to flood the carpet stains while using my water claw. Once again the carpets looked great and the next day she called again because this time not only did the spots return, but they were even bigger! I made a few phone calls, I visited my local distributor and was told the stains were coming back to due an unusual amount of residue that must be residing in the carpet padding. They told me the only solution was to use a browning agent or flood rinse the spots with Prochem All Fiber Rinse (powder). So once again I went back and this time I used a 5 gallon bucket of water with Prochem All Fiber rinse (powder) and a measuring cup simply to use as a means of pouring the solution on to the carpet while the subsurface tool was in place. I poured the solution on the carpet and flushed it over and over with the rinse solution. I used about 15 gallons of solution cleaning 7 spots on the carpet ( 2 areas which were about a foot and a half in circumference. The others were about the size of my hand. The carpet looked beautiful when I finished and one of the stains I used an entire 5 gallon bucket of the rinse solution to make sure there was no chance of that wicking occurring again and this time not only did I leave fans I also sprayed stain free on top of the carpet which is an oxidizing agent and I explained to the customer that I did everything I could and there is no reason these stains should wick back at this point. I left a few fans and was on my way.

Its only been a few hours and once again the customer has sent me a text indicating that the stains are once again coming back. I called my training rep and he still keeps implying that the problem is in the padding beneath the carpet. He says there is simply so much residue I just can't seem to get it out. I am just not sure at this point. Now I am wondering if her water could be the problem. Living in Florida we have hard water and I guess my question is could her water be causing the wicking problem or do you agree it simply is so much carpet cleaner and residue still left in the padding beneath the carpet. I feel like my only solution at this point is to use a encapsulation product or maybe Host to just clean the top surface of the carpet and not get that padding wet but for me that does not feel like it is resolving the problem because as soon as that carpet gets wet or cleaned again down the road these stains are going to rear their ugly head again.

Does anyone have any advice at this point? And in case your wondering what type of equipment I am using--I have a sapphire 370 truckmount. I attached a few pictures the customer has sent me. 2 of them are from the same area---one was taken this evening and the other was taken prior to todays cleaning.
Reclean the whole job , prespray with a peroxide cleaner or use RSF boost with a little unchained, and steam it out... Make it right
 
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psufan215

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Encap it. Mix your product with distilled water
That was my initial thought but I feel like that just puts a band aid on the problem until the next guy comes along to extract the carpet. Do you think the wicking is from all of the residue that is left in the padding from previous cleaning attempts or what are your thougths?
 

psufan215

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Feb 21, 2011
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Bill Glinka
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Encrap

Host will NOT help

me thinks the customer knows what caused this. she knew this was going to happen.

theres a thread about customers not telling the truth. This fits that description

the problem is that customers know other people like themselves, so shes going to tell everyone she knows that you were kind enough to come out multiple times to try to fix the problem and guess what? All her friends will expect the same thing.
I am getting the same response from the trainers I have spoken too. They feel there is more to the story than I am being told. They are not implying that the customer is lying but they feel there is a lot more residue in that carpet that they might not seem to be remembering all the times those areas have been treated with various products and never rinsed. Would you agree that this is a problem caused by previous cleaning attempts and there simply is a lot of residue in the padding?
 

keep it clean

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Smartstrand sucks period. It could be in the pad and coming up. But some of those backings use a spongy like latex in the back that holds the soiling. And when you add water it spreads making that brown halo. If i were really content in cleaning that spot ide pull it up. And cut out the pad plus clean csrpet from back. While it was up. Otherwise ide hit it with a peroxide encap and towel. And call it done.
 
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psufan215

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Bill Glinka
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Smartstrand sucks period. It could be in the pad and coming up. But some of those backings use a spongy like latex in the back that holds the soiling. And when you add water it spreads making that brown halo. If i were really content in cleaning that spot ide pull it up. And cut out the pad plus clean csrpet from back. While it was up. Otherwise ide hit it with a peroxide encap and towel. And call it done.
Thank you for the response. Pulling up the carpet and cutting out the pad would be nice but that is not an option. The funny thing is I watch the Smart Strand videos on youtube in which they install a carpet in a room and one side is Smart strand and the other is a different brand of nylon carpet and then they have a Rhino live in it for like a month walking around peeing and shitting everywhere and then they come in and clean the carpet and it looks like new again. What kind of crap are they pulling?

 

keep it clean

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Thank you for the response. Pulling up the carpet and cutting out the pad would be nice but that is not an option. The funny thing is I watch the Smart Strand videos on youtube in which they install a carpet in a room and one side is Smart strand and the other is a different brand of nylon carpet and then they have a Rhino live in it for like a month walking around peeing and shitting everywhere and then they come in and clean the carpet and it looks like new again. What kind of crap are they pulling?

There was a carpet that could do that. But wasn't mohawk. It was Beaulieu. It was infused with an odor neutralizer and was made from nylon. My cousin rescued dogs and man they put it to the test. Came clean with ease everytime.
 

Odin

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Thank you for the response. Pulling up the carpet and cutting out the pad would be nice but that is not an option. The funny thing is I watch the Smart Strand videos on youtube in which they install a carpet in a room and one side is Smart strand and the other is a different brand of nylon carpet and then they have a Rhino live in it for like a month walking around peeing and shitting everywhere and then they come in and clean the carpet and it looks like new again. What kind of crap are they pulling?

I love those tests because there is no oil like stains on it with those carpets just suck up oil like a sponge and never let it go
 

Thewy

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I recently cleaned a 5 bedroom house that has Mohawk Smartstrand carpet. The customer told me from the initial phone call that according to the manufacturer she only wants me to use hot water extraction and NO chemicals. Despite what she said, I still used a small amount of Red Label Cherry Bomb in my hydroforce sprayer and Extracted the carpet with Prochem Fiber rinse in my solution feed. When I finished the carpets were very clean and the customer remarked at how nice the house smelled. The following day, the customer called me back to say that many of the "spots" that were on the floor had returned. I went back and this time I used a high ph cleaner followed by a chemspec rinse in my solution line and extracted the carpet again. I even used a water claw on one of the stains. I left my fans to help dry the carpet and the following day the customer called again. I went back and told the customer I was embarrassed and she said ---no worries---this happens every time I get the carpets cleaned. The companies always have to come back 2 or 3 times because the spots keep coming back. I told her that would have been some useful information she could have shared prior to my first visit. She also admitted to using resolve and hydrogen peroxide on the carpets many times trying to remove the stains.

This time I went back and decided to take her advise and simply used water to flood the carpet stains while using my water claw. Once again the carpets looked great and the next day she called again because this time not only did the spots return, but they were even bigger! I made a few phone calls, I visited my local distributor and was told the stains were coming back to due an unusual amount of residue that must be residing in the carpet padding. They told me the only solution was to use a browning agent or flood rinse the spots with Prochem All Fiber Rinse (powder). So once again I went back and this time I used a 5 gallon bucket of water with Prochem All Fiber rinse (powder) and a measuring cup simply to use as a means of pouring the solution on to the carpet while the subsurface tool was in place. I poured the solution on the carpet and flushed it over and over with the rinse solution. I used about 15 gallons of solution cleaning 7 spots on the carpet ( 2 areas which were about a foot and a half in circumference. The others were about the size of my hand. The carpet looked beautiful when I finished and one of the stains I used an entire 5 gallon bucket of the rinse solution to make sure there was no chance of that wicking occurring again and this time not only did I leave fans I also sprayed stain free on top of the carpet which is an oxidizing agent and I explained to the customer that I did everything I could and there is no reason these stains should wick back at this point. I left a few fans and was on my way.

Its only been a few hours and once again the customer has sent me a text indicating that the stains are once again coming back. I called my training rep and he still keeps implying that the problem is in the padding beneath the carpet. He says there is simply so much residue I just can't seem to get it out. I am just not sure at this point. Now I am wondering if her water could be the problem. Living in Florida we have hard water and I guess my question is could her water be causing the wicking problem or do you agree it simply is so much carpet cleaner and residue still left in the padding beneath the carpet. I feel like my only solution at this point is to use a encapsulation product or maybe Host to just clean the top surface of the carpet and not get that padding wet but for me that does not feel like it is resolving the problem because as soon as that carpet gets wet or cleaned again down the road these stains are going to rear their ugly head again.

Does anyone have any advice at this point? And in case your wondering what type of equipment I am using--I have a sapphire 370 truckmount. I attached a few pictures the customer has sent me. 2 of them are from the same area---one was taken this evening and the other was taken prior to todays cleaning.
Did you shine a black light on it to see if it‘s an optical brightener/ some other glowing solution?
 
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Jim Davisson

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The key to jobs like this and most pet treatments is to flush the fibers, without wetting the backing or pad. That's a sure fire callback. I get paid to clean the carpet, not the subsurface unless they are going to pay me handsomely to disengage the carpet and do a PROPER pet treatment. I don't do dump and suck work for many reasons.

The hardest nut to crack is the goods bundle in the glue between the primary and secondary backing. I prefer to leave that be, the right prespray, flush the wheels off the face fibers on the acid side and bounce. Least trouble with the highest return and no callbacks.

Dew point or relative humidity play a part in dry strokes, if fans are imperative or ancillary and flow. Same house in July is not the same house in January here in the south, I can be way more cavalier in January, in July here, I would pop a dehumidifier in your job, dry that joker down and only then come in and just hwe the problem spots on the acid side. Bam, problem solved. Mother nature will work against you, if you are not paying attention. Just my .02
 

jtsunbrite

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Excellent Reply, we rarely have a callback but when we do we go back and redo the whole job , the customer needs to know you stand by your work... Show them some TLC
 

OxiFreshGuy

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Also - keep in mind that "Rhino" test, I could easily load that carpet with a ton of protectant chemicals. Voila! Cleans easy. A wand wouldn't clean that shit so well.
 

Jim Davisson

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Excellent Reply, we rarely have a callback but when we do we go back and redo the whole job , the customer needs to know you stand by your work... Show them some TLC
I know that you are well over 100,000 jobs in your career as well and aren't practicing on their stuff. Measuring jobs with no callbacks is the way forward.
 
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Fdt281

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I had a problem like this once. Ended up being heavy urine in the underpad along with self cleaning using those dumb grocery store machines.
 

ACP

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No call backs is good only if your checking in with the customers and making sure they are happy the next day.

Most people won't bother calling you back if you f up the first time, maybe 1 in 10 if your lucky
 
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Jim Davisson

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No call backs is good only if your checking in with the customers and making sure they are happy the next day.

Most people won't bother calling you back if you f up the first time, maybe 1 in 10 if your lucky
Doing property management with a vendor key means I can follow up on every freaking job I want, when I want. I know perfectly well what works, when and how.... the world is my oyster.

The advantage I have over you is that I have 50,000 more jobs than you have ever done to figure things out. I do residential, commercial and rental....