Secret formula acid rinse

M4sT3R T3CH

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I thought acid rinses were suppose to prevent buildup in machinery or is that alkaline rinses?
I have no idea. I was told to not use powdered emulsifiers years ago. So i have been using liquid ones every since. I dont use alkaline ones because i already use alkaline presprays. But i never had issues with end zone or all fiber rinse. And i know im mixing the product well. Oh well.
 
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SRD

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I have no idea. I was told to not use powdered emulsifiers years ago. So i have been using liquid ones every since. I dont use alkaline ones because i already use alkaline presprays. But i never had issues with end zone or all fiber rinse. And i know im mixing the product well. Oh well.
Need to know what the material is thats clogging your filters man....could be filler that didnt mix, could be scale breaking loose..just because you have a softener doesnt mean your necessarily scale free. End zone and all fiber rinse are both liquid and they may not be as strong of an acid not sure
 
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willoughby1

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I have no idea. I was told to not use powdered emulsifiers years ago. So i have been using liquid ones every since. I dont use alkaline ones because i already use alkaline presprays. But i never had issues with end zone or all fiber rinse. And i know im mixing the product well. Oh well.
Right I also use an alkaline prespray which is why I use and acid rinse but everything I've read says its suppose to be better on your machinery maybe it's talking about corrosion of material not clogging... Idk
 

M4sT3R T3CH

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I have no idea. I was told to not use powdered emulsifiers years ago. So i have been using liquid ones every since. I dont use alkaline ones because i already use alkaline presprays. But i never had issues with end zone or all fiber rinse. And i know im mixing the product well. Oh well.
Need to know what the material is thats clogging your filters man....could be filler that didnt mix, could be scale breaking loose..just because you have a softener doesnt mean your necessarily scale free. End zone and all fiber rinse are both liquid and they may not be as strong of an acid not sure
True
 

willoughby1

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I used prochems heat wave years ago i was told it will actually clean your TM as u use it. I personally dont like leaving the carpets at a high ph.
Ok so maybe its alkaline rinses that clean your machine as you use it I thought that was acids... Idk lol
 
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rob allen

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I personally run an alkaline (8.0 so barely alkaline) at 1/2 dilution. Works like a champ.
 

Anderson

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All acid rinses can descale your hx coils......
To a certain degree
And send soap scum thru your lines

Some alcaline rinses tend to build up soapmscum more than others....
Prochem dry slurry is one that has more white soap in the lines
 

Tom Forsythe

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We worked on End Zone for about a year and introduced in 2003. We have several complaints about build up after customers switched over to End Zone. We learned that in the case of End Zone, it was cleaning out the lines. Descaling your machine is a good practice especially when you switch to a new rinse.

I worked 2 years on Flex Ice. We had several issues of sediment build up and thought that it was the same issue that we had in End Zone. There was one difference between the situations as we found that hard water, high heat machines, and Flex Ice were the variables in almost all of the reported issues. Most were solved with the switch to soft water. In fact one of our truckmount gurus always told me that if any sediment builds up then start with soft water to solve the problem. We had one high heat machine that built up sediment with Flex Ice and with a few other industry benchmarks even after going to soft water. Of course having a water softener does not mean you have soft water unless you take all of the steps to keep it charged properly.

The working theory is that the last step chemical injection is adding the solution to vapor (not soluble like water) in hot truckmounts. Hard water scale separates from water more readily in hot truckmounts and some of the less soluble parts of the Flex Ice formula (the best cleaning ingredients in the formula) did the same. The result was sediment from hard water scale and a few less soluble ingredients in Flex Ice. At this point we were recommending water softeners for everyone who uses Flex Ice. I have not had a reported complaint in a long time.

This led us to expand our research to see how hard water affected all of our powdered rinses. Hard water creates sediment with Flex Ice, but we found that in hard water areas that our powdered rinses were severely compromised. Our cleaning agents which are also water softeners were tied up softening water and not available for cleaning. This article summarizes our findings from two years of research: http://www.cleanfax.com/carpet-care/water-quality-extraction-rinses/
The results of this research were presented by Scott Warrington and myself at the IICRC science conference last August. This is also why Scott and I have been talking about water softeners in almost every thread that talks about rinses. You always start with soft water before you pick or change your rinse!!
 
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M4sT3R T3CH

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We worked on End Zone for about a year and introduced in 2003. We have several complaints about build up after customers switched over to End Zone. We learned that in the case of End Zone, it was cleaning out the lines. Descaling your machine is a good practice especially when you switch to a new rinse.

I worked 2 years on Flex Ice. We had several issues of sediment build up and thought that it was the same issue that we had in End Zone. There was one difference between the situations as we found that hard water, high heat machines, and Flex Ice were the variables in almost all of the reported issues. Most were solved with the switch to soft water. In fact one of our truckmount gurus always told me that if any sediment builds up then start with soft water to solve the problem. We had one high heat machine that built up sediment with Flex Ice and with a few other industry benchmarks even after going to soft water. Of course having a water softener does not mean you have soft water unless you take all of the steps to keep it charged properly.

The working theory is that the last step chemical injection is adding the solution to vapor (not soluble like water) in hot truckmounts. Hard water scale separates from water more readily in hot truckmounts and some of the less soluble parts of the Flex Ice formula (the best cleaning ingredients in the formula) did the same. The result was sediment from hard water scale and a few less soluble ingredients in Flex Ice. At this point we were recommending water softeners for everyone who uses Flex Ice. I have not had a reported complaint in a long time.

This led us to expand our research to see how hard water affected all of our powdered rinses. Hard water creates sediment with Flex Ice, but we found that in hard water areas that our powdered rinses were severely compromised. Our cleaning agents which are also water softeners were tied up softening water and not available for cleaning. This article summarizes our findings from two years of research: http://www.cleanfax.com/carpet-care/water-quality-extraction-rinses/
The results of this research were presented by Scott Warrington and myself at the IICRC science conference last August. This is also why Scott and I have been talking about water softeners in almost every thread that talks about rinses. You always start with soft water before you pick or change your rinse!!
Thanks for the info. So i should recharge my water softner and try again?
 

Fedri

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I personally run an alkaline (8.0 so barely alkaline) at 1/2 dilution. Works like a champ.
Rob I agree with you, I love the way your sf rinse 8ph rinses, how ever I don't agree that rinsing agent leaves residue crystals when it dries which needs to be vacuumed, not all my customers will vacuum, what happens then? It will re soil quickly
 

Swani21

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We worked on End Zone for about a year and introduced in 2003. We have several complaints about build up after customers switched over to End Zone. We learned that in the case of End Zone, it was cleaning out the lines. Descaling your machine is a good practice especially when you switch to a new rinse.

I worked 2 years on Flex Ice. We had several issues of sediment build up and thought that it was the same issue that we had in End Zone. There was one difference between the situations as we found that hard water, high heat machines, and Flex Ice were the variables in almost all of the reported issues. Most were solved with the switch to soft water. In fact one of our truckmount gurus always told me that if any sediment builds up then start with soft water to solve the problem. We had one high heat machine that built up sediment with Flex Ice and with a few other industry benchmarks even after going to soft water. Of course having a water softener does not mean you have soft water unless you take all of the steps to keep it charged properly.

The working theory is that the last step chemical injection is adding the solution to vapor (not soluble like water) in hot truckmounts. Hard water scale separates from water more readily in hot truckmounts and some of the less soluble parts of the Flex Ice formula (the best cleaning ingredients in the formula) did the same. The result was sediment from hard water scale and a few less soluble ingredients in Flex Ice. At this point we were recommending water softeners for everyone who uses Flex Ice. I have not had a reported complaint in a long time.

This led us to expand our research to see how hard water affected all of our powdered rinses. Hard water creates sediment with Flex Ice, but we found that in hard water areas that our powdered rinses were severely compromised. Our cleaning agents which are also water softeners were tied up softening water and not available for cleaning. This article summarizes our findings from two years of research: http://www.cleanfax.com/carpet-care/water-quality-extraction-rinses/
The results of this research were presented by Scott Warrington and myself at the IICRC science conference last August. This is also why Scott and I have been talking about water softeners in almost every thread that talks about rinses. You always start with soft water before you pick or change your rinse!!
I started out with End Zone then switched to Flex Ice. What I've personally found is that Flex Ice kicks ass with soft water otherwise End Zone is what's needed!
 
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M4sT3R T3CH

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I personally run an alkaline (8.0 so barely alkaline) at 1/2 dilution. Works like a champ.
Rob I agree with you, I love the way your sf rinse 8ph rinses, how ever I don't agree that rinsing agent leaves residue crystals when it dries which needs to be vacuumed, not all my customers will vacuum, what happens then? It will re soil quickly
Maybe im wrong but an alkaline is a detergent not a rinse agent.
 

Fedri

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Maybe im wrong but an alkaline is a detergent not a rinse agent.
I don't know who is right and who is wrong but as far as I know there is an alkaline or acid rinsing. That is what I meant. On most jobs I prefer alkaline rinsing so it has more effectiveness while cleaning. I can acid rinse if the carpet has been vacuumed daily and has very light soil without any stains.
 
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ACP

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I wont run anything thru a truckmount other than acid rinse, procyon, or a very light deodorizer.

Ive heard nightmare stories about someone running various chems which didnt mix and ended up with a concrete like substance clogging up all the lines. Huge project to clean it all out.

I believe he was running a deodorizer that contained quat, and then at some point switched to an acid rinse... the two didnt mix well and turned the lines rock hard, filled the little giant coil with the same rock hard white crap

playing around with different pre sprays is one thing, but playing around with rinses you run through a $20,000-30,000 machine is a different story