Oxygen Boosters - Overrated/Overpriced vs Oxi-Clean Products?

[GregAllen]

The active ingredients in the expensive boosters we buy from industry suppliers are generally Percarbonate (sometimes called Sodium Percarbonate and Sodium Carbonate Peroxide ) and just Sodium Carbonate. One item by Steamway shows Percarbonate as the only ingredient.

OxiClean and other similar "store-bought" products have these as their active ingredients as well, but are MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE.

Question: Have any of you tested the OxiClean, Oxiwash, Oxo Brite, etc. products against these industry boosters that we buy for two and three times more money? Best I can tell, they are the NEARLY the same.

For example, OxoBrite's ingredients are sodium carbonate, sodium carbonate peroxide, and sodium metasilicate, the EXACT ingredients in some of our most high respected boosters selling for DOUBLE.



Thoughts?

 

[kleen14u]

Don't forget soda ash the added ingredient or filler in sodium percarbonate .
What I can't understand is guy's say they mix it in a 5 gallon bucket hot and let the oxygen bubbles subside and then pour it into their sprayer. I thought this was the whole purpose of this product an extra molecule of oxygen. Once it off gasses aren't you losing the effectiveness of the product?
Heat kills Peroxide but at the same time it makes it an excellent cleaner until the oxygen is gone and your basically left with water.
So what am I missing or over thinking.

 

[wandwizard]

The active ingredients in the expensive boosters we buy from industry suppliers are generally Percarbonate (sometimes called Sodium Percarbonate and Sodium Carbonate Peroxide ) and just Sodium Carbonate. One item by Steamway shows Percarbonate as the only ingredient.

OxiClean and other similar "store-bought" products have these as their active ingredients as well, but are MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE.

Question: Have any of you tested the OxiClean, Oxiwash, Oxo Brite, etc. products against these industry boosters that we buy for two and three times more money? Best I can tell, they are the NEARLY the same.

For example, OxoBrite's ingredients are sodium carbonate, sodium carbonate peroxide, and sodium metasilicate, the EXACT ingredients in some of our most high respected boosters selling for DOUBLE.



Thoughts?

I've thought the same thing. I haven't done a pound for pound comparison of the products. Typically the products of this type we use are in about 6 to 7 lb. containers costing I think an average of probably around 40 bucks (just guessing w/o checking} Some are higher while some may be a bit cheaper. Right now I have Matrix Miracle in the van and it's 35.97 for 5.75 lbs. I find it does work better on the urine odor that products with just sodium percarb. I know some of these products have added ingredients that help destroy the odor and w/o them you will either have to add an additional deodorizer or do a separate treatment. It is almost all sodium percarbonate, but obviously has some extra ingredients they aren't telling us about. http://https://shop.truckmountforums.com/media/pdf/msds_docs/MS-MX-MM.pdf

The other issue is I like to use products that are industry approved. I'm not saying it isn't ok under some circumstances to use a cheaper product, but if your charging enough it just makes sense to use the best products for the job.

 

[kleen14u]

I understand but my point is if you let it off gas or expire before using isn't the product useless. Example, Peroxide comes in a brown bottle (3%) and tells you to store it in a cool place....Why? Because heat,air and sunlight kill it. Pour it on a cut and when it quits fizz in its done...it's water at that point and no longer effective .
I guess what I'm asking is why mix it with to hot of water and let it off gas or deplete the extra molecule of oxygen and pour it into your sprayer and think it is going to be as effective.
I'm talking about powdered Peroxide but at the same point I carry liquid Peroxide in a cooler with ice packs during the summer because heat kills it.

 

[Common janitor]

I've thought the same thing. I haven't done a pound for pound comparison of the products. Typically the products of this type we use are in about 6 to 7 lb. containers costing I think an average of probably around 40 bucks (just guessing w/o checking} Some are higher while some may be a bit cheaper. Right now I have Matrix Miracle in the van and it's 35.97 for 5.75 lbs. I find it does work better on the urine odor that products with just sodium percarb. I know some of these products have added ingredients that help destroy the odor and w/o them you will either have to add an additional deodorizer or do a separate treatment. It is almost all sodium percarbonate, but obviously has some extra ingredients they aren't telling us about. http://https://shop.truckmountforums.com/media/pdf/msds_docs/MS-MX-MM.pdf

The other issue is I like to use products that are industry approved. I'm not saying it isn't ok under some circumstances to use a cheaper product, but if your charging enough it just makes sense to use the best products for the job.

Thought about this subject a great deal and came to the same conclusion . Just not worth it to me . I too think A LOT of what we purchase is way overpriced . I'm using what works for what I'm cleaning ....... Matrix Miracle works . Done .
All the Best, Ed

 

[goomer]

Most consumer products including Oxiclean are 30-40 percent SP plus ? filler.

Most industry products appear to be 80-90% SP with whatever filler being somewhat more specific to industry applications.

 

[smart n kleen]

I get mine at cobbs, it's cheap and pretty good. I get the powder and liquid form.

 

[Joe cool]

So dont keep a 6 lb jug of petzone in the van thru the summer

 

[LookNGood]

I understand but my point is if you let it off gas or expire before using isn't the product useless. Example, Peroxide comes in a brown bottle (3%) and tells you to store it in a cool place....Why? Because heat,air and sunlight kill it. Pour it on a cut and when it quits fizz in its done...it's water at that point and no longer effective .
I guess what I'm asking is why mix it with to hot of water and let it off gas or deplete the extra molecule of oxygen and pour it into your sprayer and think it is going to be as effective.
I'm talking about powdered Peroxide but at the same point I carry liquid Peroxide in a cooler with ice packs during the summer because heat kills it.

You can't kill peroxide as it is not alive...

Once it is a liquid it will DECOMPOSE no matter what you do. The presence of heat or light add energy to the chemicals and catalyze the decomposition.

 

[LookNGood]

Thought about this subject a great deal and came to the same conclusion . Just not worth it to me . I too think A LOT of what we purchase is way overpriced . I'm using what works for what I'm cleaning ....... Matrix Miracle works . Done .
All the Best, Ed

Ed this is not a comment at you. But just a comment on the price we pay.

Here's the thing. My chemical cost on my average job is less than $10...

So clearly the cost of Chems is not that big of a deal. Buy the right products, mix and use them properly and you are all set.

Now I did a big tile job recently where I acid washed and rinsed with alkaline. Well where do I need the acid, on the grout only. So obviously to save money I sprayed only the grout lines with the acid (there were other reasons for minimizing the acid also)

Anyway this was a $6k job and it cost me less than $150 in Chems. Thats 2.5% of the job...should I really care about trying to reduce that to 2%? As an owner operator the answer is no. As Stanley Steemer the answer would be yes. Because that 0.5% on 1000 jobs daily adds up to makes a huge difference.

So let's not get too caught up on the cost of Chems. If the cost of Chems is hurting your bottom line it's time to raise your prices or get out of the business.

 

[matt30577]

Ed this is not a comment at you. But just a comment on the price we pay.

Here's the thing. My chemical cost on my average job is less than $10...

So clearly the cost of Chems is not that big of a deal. Buy the right products, mix and use them properly and you are all set.

Now I did a big tile job recently where I acid washed and rinsed with alkaline. Well where do I need the acid, on the grout only. So obviously to save money I sprayed only the grout lines with the acid (there were other reasons for minimizing the acid also)

Anyway this was a $6k job and it cost me less than $150 in Chems. Thats 2.5% of the job...should I really care about trying to reduce that to 2%? As an owner operator the answer is no. As Stanley Steemer the answer would be yes. Because that 0.5% on 1000 jobs daily adds up to makes a huge difference.

So let's not get too caught up on the cost of Chems. If the cost of Chems is hurting your bottom line it's time to raise your prices or get out of the business.

This thread is almost the same thread I started somewhere in '09-'10. And it ended with the exact same post as yours. It was about using powdered laundry detergent, instead of the $50/gallon of the name brand pre spray.

I'm sure it gets down to as little as a few dollars per job, but when we buy a $1000 worth of it at one time, it can definitely hurt the wallet. If something store bought at wally world is just as good but half the price, then someone needs to come out and tell us.

I have a good friend in this business who is just as experienced as we are and is very professional at it. He's not a hack...Yet he makes almost all of his chemicals with over the counter detergents and oxidizers. He won't tell me exactly what he uses, but I'm sure its nothing more than laundry detergent and oxy clean.

 

[LookNGood]

This thread is almost the same thread I started somewhere in '09-'10. And it ended with the exact same post as yours. It was about using powdered laundry detergent, instead of the $50/gallon of the name brand pre spray.

I'm sure it gets down to as little as a few dollars per job, but when we buy a $1000 worth of it at one time, it can definitely hurt the wallet. If something store bought at wally world is just as good but half the price, then someone needs to come out and tell us.

I have a good friend in this business who is just as experienced as we are and is very professional at it. He's not a hack...Yet he makes almost all of his chemicals with over the counter detergents and oxidizers. He won't tell me exactly what he uses, but I'm sure its nothing more than laundry detergent and oxy clean.

And the time spent mixing and concocting could have been spent doing a whole lot of things to grow his business and better his financial situation. I'm not saying he is wrong, but yeah he is wrong.

 

[matt30577]

And the time spent mixing and concocting could have been spent doing a whole lot of things to grow his business and better his financial situation. I'm not saying he is wrong, but yeah he is wrong.

I don't know if he's wrong...maybe a tightwad, but not wrong. If you remember, he questioned carpet protector being worth what they charged us for it. I was just pointing to the fact that it's not rocket science to mix a detergent with a powdered peroxide. It is just a different way to look at it.

 

[tonyb14]

I get mine at cobbs, it's cheap and pretty good. I get the powder and liquid form.

Cobbs liquid fabric brightener say on the jug not to mix with alkaline presprays.
Any idea why?

 

[Nomad74]

Cobbs liquid fabric brightener say on the jug not to mix with alkaline presprays.
Any idea why?

I think it may turn to rubber in the hose. I know bristors stuff will do that.

 

[wandwizard]

.Any idea why?[/QUOTE]

Just a guess, but I suspect it will accelerate the action of the product. Instead of brightening the fabric you could potentially bleach it. Oxidizers are accelerated by alkaline. I suspect that is an oxidizer of some sort. If that's what it says on the label I'd stick with it.

 

[Pinosan]

I understand but my point is if you let it off gas or expire before using isn't the product useless. Example, Peroxide comes in a brown bottle (3%) and tells you to store it in a cool place....Why? Because heat,air and sunlight kill it. Pour it on a cut and when it quits fizz in its done...it's water at that point and no longer effective .
I guess what I'm asking is why mix it with to hot of water and let it off gas or deplete the extra molecule of oxygen and pour it into your sprayer and think it is going to be as effective.
I'm talking about powdered Peroxide but at the same point I carry liquid Peroxide in a cooler with ice packs during the summer because heat kills it.

the answer is no. It would take about about 1hr for the oxigen to completely dissipate. If you mix it in a glass and let it sit there you can se the activity of the oxigen as if you were looking at a glass full of pellegrino water.

 

[Pinosan]

When you guys compare laundry detergents to industry designed cleaning products, you are comparing night and day. Yes most of the active ingredients are the same at different concentrations and mixed with different other ingredients such as surfactants to aid the active ingredients.

there is a reason why tide and sun laundry detergents don't clean the same yet they are in the same category in the same isle inside the store.
Or the reason why some are suddless for specific use on washing machines and others foam like dogs with the rabies.

This is a chemistry topic not a chemical ingredient by itself topic. With all the laundry detergent ingredients mentioned above and others not mentioned one can make a good carpet cleaner product there is no doubt. But in the same token one can make a catastrophic mixing that will compromise not only the health of the carpet but that of the ones living in that house.

just my two cents.

 

[kleen14u]

the answer is no. It would take about about 1hr for the oxigen to completely dissipate. If you mix it in a glass and let it sit there you can se the activity of the oxigen as if you were looking at a glass full of pellegrino water.

I'll give it a try and thanks for your input.

 

[skg]

There's a book called predictably irrational that gave the following example the best I can remember it:

If you're about to purchase a suit for $250 and found out it was $5 cheaper 10 minutes down the road, most likely you would just pay the $250.

On the other hand if you were about to purchase a $10 pen and found out it was half price 10 minutes down the road, you would most likely drive the 10 minutes to save $5.

It's the same amount of time for the same $5 savings.

A lot of times we think in terms of ratios instead of overall time and money.