Ones leaving and joining TMF

SAA

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Jul 12, 2008
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I decided to just start a new thread rather than answer to or post in someone else's thread about leaving TMF. I mean this to be respectful and I did not want to try to hijack a thread that someone else started.

My reason(s) for starting this one was related to why someone may leave or why some may not post. No one may care and some may care. I do not know but I feel it may be good to make a statement or two.

There were some points about ones trying to make money off of their information and in reality, that is why anyone would be on a forum, to have help with things so that ultimately ones can 'make money' in some form, that is why most would be here. To expect everyone to give away any thing they have learned and to expect them to give it for 'free' is not reality. I personally have given away a lot to different ones and never ask for or expect anything monetarily from them. Then there are other times I simply will not share something without cost and if one needs or wants it, there are videos I do sell, but rarely promote them outright.

The same can be said of Rob and Tre on TMF, they have given and given a lot and now that they wish to help with advanced education for others, they have to make a return on these things, we are all in business to make money and if we can help along the way with others, then that is great also. Still, everyone seems to want to make money on what they do but will ask for things for free when it is not always feasible or reasonable from someone else.

I can only speak for myself but there have been many times I would like to comment on a post but in reality, when I see the direction it is going or who may be posting, I simply will not post due to the rudeness of some and often due to the direction of vulgarity that is going on. There is no professionalism in any of these types of items. Personally, I would love to share more and help more and 'give back' a little to an industry that has provided a very good living and career for me for over 40 years. One in which I have had a lot of help through the early years when I really needed it. I remember how that felt and I remember how grateful I was to the help I received. I have tried to help different ones here, when possible and often feel I will do so privately for any who may want the help. This is not to 'toot' my own horn but simply a desire to share and maybe in some small way pay back a little for all of the help I received in the past.

As an observation, I believe if ones took this more seriously, then others that are willing to help or that can help, would be willing to do more. This is a business and it should be treated as such. Respect begets respect. It is a fact of life.

I instructed for over 17 years in this industry and all through that time I still ran a service company. In all those years, I never had to remove a student from my classroom ( came close one time in St Louis, I still remember it well). I also did not use vulgar language nor did I allow it. For me, it was a joy to do this type of work and I took it very seriously. I have spent a lot of time and money for different forms of education and it was all worth it in some form or another.

I am not sure of anyone else but I would love to see serious questions and serious answers and proof as to why something is said, so that it can be documented in some way that will actually help others. It was a long time ago but I still remember how lost I was at times and how even a little help was greatly appreciated.

Not sure if anyone really cares much but there is a lot of work out there and if ones learn to think outside of the proverbial box, it can open a lot of doors.

Anyway, I for one would love to help in any way possible and to see good conversations going with photos and videos to show or teach others that may need a little help or even a little gentle push in the right direction. If it is going to be nonsense and a lot of smack talk, I am not interested in those conversations and I would think others who are serious about their business would not be either, but then I may simply be a dinosaur that just doesn't know what will help others.

I completely left a different board years ago because of 'stupidity". As it has been clearly stated before, 'You can fix ignorance because one simply does not know and they can learn' but the other side of the coin is also true, "You can't fix Stupid'.

This has been a pretty good board and one I have enjoyed overall, I would like to see it continue on with a much better attitude conducive to learning and at least a little respect.

I hope that is not too much to expect but time and comments will tell.

Just my thoughts and I do realize, they are not that important but I thought I would try to express my thoughts on the matter but I could be completely wrong?

Just to name a few conversations that I think would help a lot would be the following, and there are many more but these would help ones a lot, IMO:

Learning about fibers and their characteristics. I read over and over again ones making erroneous comments about a fiber and it is obvious they are just repeating wrong information. Learning about fibers and their characteristics can go a long way to helping ones to 'Know' what they are doing. This is not a little matter but it is treated as unimportant in many posts and this could easily be improved on.

TESTING. There are so many posts that are made that if all of us could learn how to do some simple testing, such as, Fiber ID; Cleaning Tests; Chemical Testing; Testing if Protective Coating is there or if it is needed; these are all valuable tests that will help ones to Know what to do next.

How to Clean aggressively but safely. How to understand the basics of pH and what it really means. What it means to understand the Cleaning Steps and why each one is important. This would change peoples lives in the cleaning business.

There is a lot more but I will stop here. This entire post is to try to help but it may not really be that important to many. It may also just show my foolishness in even making a thread like this.

Any serious comments are welcome, even if one disagrees.

SAA
 

Smtwn janitorial

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I'm here to learn. Thanks for the knowledge that you can share. Never stop learning. Those topics seem to be ones that I am semi ignorant about.
I don't mind if folks have a sense of humor or disagree about something. We all have free will for that. Personal attacks are just a waste of time and energy. Keep on posting. Thanks.
 
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Swani21

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Oct 8, 2015
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Nick S.
I decided to just start a new thread rather than answer to or post in someone else's thread about leaving TMF. I mean this to be respectful and I did not want to try to hijack a thread that someone else started.

My reason(s) for starting this one was related to why someone may leave or why some may not post. No one may care and some may care. I do not know but I feel it may be good to make a statement or two.

There were some points about ones trying to make money off of their information and in reality, that is why anyone would be on a forum, to have help with things so that ultimately ones can 'make money' in some form, that is why most would be here. To expect everyone to give away any thing they have learned and to expect them to give it for 'free' is not reality. I personally have given away a lot to different ones and never ask for or expect anything monetarily from them. Then there are other times I simply will not share something without cost and if one needs or wants it, there are videos I do sell, but rarely promote them outright.

The same can be said of Rob and Tre on TMF, they have given and given a lot and now that they wish to help with advanced education for others, they have to make a return on these things, we are all in business to make money and if we can help along the way with others, then that is great also. Still, everyone seems to want to make money on what they do but will ask for things for free when it is not always feasible or reasonable from someone else.

I can only speak for myself but there have been many times I would like to comment on a post but in reality, when I see the direction it is going or who may be posting, I simply will not post due to the rudeness of some and often due to the direction of vulgarity that is going on. There is no professionalism in any of these types of items. Personally, I would love to share more and help more and 'give back' a little to an industry that has provided a very good living and career for me for over 40 years. One in which I have had a lot of help through the early years when I really needed it. I remember how that felt and I remember how grateful I was to the help I received. I have tried to help different ones here, when possible and often feel I will do so privately for any who may want the help. This is not to 'toot' my own horn but simply a desire to share and maybe in some small way pay back a little for all of the help I received in the past.

As an observation, I believe if ones took this more seriously, then others that are willing to help or that can help, would be willing to do more. This is a business and it should be treated as such. Respect begets respect. It is a fact of life.

I instructed for over 17 years in this industry and all through that time I still ran a service company. In all those years, I never had to remove a student from my classroom ( came close one time in St Louis, I still remember it well). I also did not use vulgar language nor did I allow it. For me, it was a joy to do this type of work and I took it very seriously. I have spent a lot of time and money for different forms of education and it was all worth it in some form or another.

I am not sure of anyone else but I would love to see serious questions and serious answers and proof as to why something is said, so that it can be documented in some way that will actually help others. It was a long time ago but I still remember how lost I was at times and how even a little help was greatly appreciated.

Not sure if anyone really cares much but there is a lot of work out there and if ones learn to think outside of the proverbial box, it can open a lot of doors.

Anyway, I for one would love to help in any way possible and to see good conversations going with photos and videos to show or teach others that may need a little help or even a little gentle push in the right direction. If it is going to be nonsense and a lot of smack talk, I am not interested in those conversations and I would think others who are serious about their business would not be either, but then I may simply be a dinosaur that just doesn't know what will help others.

I completely left a different board years ago because of 'stupidity". As it has been clearly stated before, 'You can fix ignorance because one simply does not know and they can learn' but the other side of the coin is also true, "You can't fix Stupid'.

This has been a pretty good board and one I have enjoyed overall, I would like to see it continue on with a much better attitude conducive to learning and at least a little respect.

I hope that is not too much to expect but time and comments will tell.

Just my thoughts and I do realize, they are not that important but I thought I would try to express my thoughts on the matter but I could be completely wrong?

Just to name a few conversations that I think would help a lot would be the following, and there are many more but these would help ones a lot, IMO:

Learning about fibers and their characteristics. I read over and over again ones making erroneous comments about a fiber and it is obvious they are just repeating wrong information. Learning about fibers and their characteristics can go a long way to helping ones to 'Know' what they are doing. This is not a little matter but it is treated as unimportant in many posts and this could easily be improved on.

TESTING. There are so many posts that are made that if all of us could learn how to do some simple testing, such as, Fiber ID; Cleaning Tests; Chemical Testing; Testing if Protective Coating is there or if it is needed; these are all valuable tests that will help ones to Know what to do next.

How to Clean aggressively but safely. How to understand the basics of pH and what it really means. What it means to understand the Cleaning Steps and why each one is important. This would change peoples lives in the cleaning business.

There is a lot more but I will stop here. This entire post is to try to help but it may not really be that important to many. It may also just show my foolishness in even making a thread like this.

Any serious comments are welcome, even if one disagrees.

SAA
Well put! Nice post!
 

powerhouse_cc

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Feb 15, 2017
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Jeff farmer
061c25ba9a2dbfb9404929e1a376be75.jpg
 

Todd the Cleaner

Todd Cottino
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Sep 4, 2011
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I decided to just start a new thread rather than answer to or post in someone else's thread about leaving TMF. I mean this to be respectful and I did not want to try to hijack a thread that someone else started.

My reason(s) for starting this one was related to why someone may leave or why some may not post. No one may care and some may care. I do not know but I feel it may be good to make a statement or two.

There were some points about ones trying to make money off of their information and in reality, that is why anyone would be on a forum, to have help with things so that ultimately ones can 'make money' in some form, that is why most would be here. To expect everyone to give away any thing they have learned and to expect them to give it for 'free' is not reality. I personally have given away a lot to different ones and never ask for or expect anything monetarily from them. Then there are other times I simply will not share something without cost and if one needs or wants it, there are videos I do sell, but rarely promote them outright.

The same can be said of Rob and Tre on TMF, they have given and given a lot and now that they wish to help with advanced education for others, they have to make a return on these things, we are all in business to make money and if we can help along the way with others, then that is great also. Still, everyone seems to want to make money on what they do but will ask for things for free when it is not always feasible or reasonable from someone else.

I can only speak for myself but there have been many times I would like to comment on a post but in reality, when I see the direction it is going or who may be posting, I simply will not post due to the rudeness of some and often due to the direction of vulgarity that is going on. There is no professionalism in any of these types of items. Personally, I would love to share more and help more and 'give back' a little to an industry that has provided a very good living and career for me for over 40 years. One in which I have had a lot of help through the early years when I really needed it. I remember how that felt and I remember how grateful I was to the help I received. I have tried to help different ones here, when possible and often feel I will do so privately for any who may want the help. This is not to 'toot' my own horn but simply a desire to share and maybe in some small way pay back a little for all of the help I received in the past.

As an observation, I believe if ones took this more seriously, then others that are willing to help or that can help, would be willing to do more. This is a business and it should be treated as such. Respect begets respect. It is a fact of life.

I instructed for over 17 years in this industry and all through that time I still ran a service company. In all those years, I never had to remove a student from my classroom ( came close one time in St Louis, I still remember it well). I also did not use vulgar language nor did I allow it. For me, it was a joy to do this type of work and I took it very seriously. I have spent a lot of time and money for different forms of education and it was all worth it in some form or another.

I am not sure of anyone else but I would love to see serious questions and serious answers and proof as to why something is said, so that it can be documented in some way that will actually help others. It was a long time ago but I still remember how lost I was at times and how even a little help was greatly appreciated.

Not sure if anyone really cares much but there is a lot of work out there and if ones learn to think outside of the proverbial box, it can open a lot of doors.

Anyway, I for one would love to help in any way possible and to see good conversations going with photos and videos to show or teach others that may need a little help or even a little gentle push in the right direction. If it is going to be nonsense and a lot of smack talk, I am not interested in those conversations and I would think others who are serious about their business would not be either, but then I may simply be a dinosaur that just doesn't know what will help others.

I completely left a different board years ago because of 'stupidity". As it has been clearly stated before, 'You can fix ignorance because one simply does not know and they can learn' but the other side of the coin is also true, "You can't fix Stupid'.

This has been a pretty good board and one I have enjoyed overall, I would like to see it continue on with a much better attitude conducive to learning and at least a little respect.

I hope that is not too much to expect but time and comments will tell.

Just my thoughts and I do realize, they are not that important but I thought I would try to express my thoughts on the matter but I could be completely wrong?

Just to name a few conversations that I think would help a lot would be the following, and there are many more but these would help ones a lot, IMO:

Learning about fibers and their characteristics. I read over and over again ones making erroneous comments about a fiber and it is obvious they are just repeating wrong information. Learning about fibers and their characteristics can go a long way to helping ones to 'Know' what they are doing. This is not a little matter but it is treated as unimportant in many posts and this could easily be improved on.

TESTING. There are so many posts that are made that if all of us could learn how to do some simple testing, such as, Fiber ID; Cleaning Tests; Chemical Testing; Testing if Protective Coating is there or if it is needed; these are all valuable tests that will help ones to Know what to do next.

How to Clean aggressively but safely. How to understand the basics of pH and what it really means. What it means to understand the Cleaning Steps and why each one is important. This would change peoples lives in the cleaning business.

There is a lot more but I will stop here. This entire post is to try to help but it may not really be that important to many. It may also just show my foolishness in even making a thread like this.

Any serious comments are welcome, even if one disagrees.

SAA
Great topic and great post Steve.

I actually found TMF back in 2011 when I was having a problem with wick back on CGD in an office. I had heard about VLM but knew absolutely nothing about it. I went to the internet to try and learn about it and came across the Cleanfax forum. I joined and asked some questions about VLM and one of the guys told me about TMF. The rest is history.

I always appreciate your contribution to the forum Steve and I can honestly say you have taught me a lot over the last few years. I had never done a carpet repair before meeting you and buying your videos. Because of your videos along with much help you have given for free on the forum I am starting to feel comfortable with doing repairs. I'm still a beginner and have a lot to learn. I really appreciate the help you have been to me.

I particularly like the threads on TMF that are focused on the learning. It's also good to be able to hang out with the guys and joke around as well. I'll agree it sometimes goes a little far and sometimes gets to being inappropriate. I'd like to think that doesn't happen as much now as it used to. I guess with the competitive nature of the business there will always be a few who go too far. I still feel that overall the forum is a positive place. If there is anything that anyone sees that I can do to help make TMF a better place please speak up and tell me your thoughts.
 

floorclean

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Mar 31, 2016
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In any of the courses I have taken over the years I can wholeheartedly say none of them has made me a better cleaner. But by the same token the 100% free YouTube videos Rob have posted made me MUCH better carpet cleaner. There are thing's in the hundreds of videos that could only be related with someone who as spent a life time loving what they do. I could be wrong but I've today never read anyone saying how much they are appreciated! Thanks rob they at least weren't wasted!
 

StevenB.

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Sep 29, 2012
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I spend more time on the TMF than I do other boards. I try hard to stay out of the pissing matches between the high profile personalities in this industry. I like to have a good idea what's going on and who the "players" are and thats about it. There is a wealth of information available here and plenty willing to help. I can say that about other boards but I honestly feel this is a more active and involved community so you will get more useful responses in a shorter amount of time.
 

Mama Fen

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It can be tough sometimes for those of us on the technical side of the fence to relate to the fellows working the trenches. We (and yes, I mean ME specifically, lol) tend to live in The World Of How It Should Be Done, rather than in a boots-on-the-ground reality. Chemistry, thermodynamics, biology, physics, they're all fascinating and pertinent, but going back to the infamous pH thread, sometimes people don't need to know why something works, they just need to know it works.

A certain level of information helps the end user make on-the-spot choices when his go-to chemical just isn't working, or spilled in his truck, or his tech used it all up without telling him. Too much information, though, becomes white noise.

I err on the side of giving too much info a lot of the time - it's the nature of my job. Guys come in all the time with questions about how and why and what, and I am expected to have answers. It's a wonder my head doesn't explode sometimes.

With that in mind, there's also the other end of the spectrum - the unprofessional, uneducated, catch-as-catch-can guys who chase cheap jobs with laundry detergent and fabric softener just to pay the bills. They tend to give the industry as a whole a bad rep, and the rest of the cleaning population has to work that much harder to overcome a negative perception. Even the best-intentioned new cleaner with stars in his eyes and hope in his heart can fall into the trap of chasing prices, when he sees his "competition" getting thrown in his face by Groupon fanatics who refuse to pay anything higher than the lowest possible price. And once down that path, it's difficult to turn around.

And ne'er the twain shall meet, heh. Or perhaps, over time, they meet here.

This forum always seemed like a good place for balance. A place where cleaners could come for war stories, success stories, technical data, a good laugh, and - perhaps most importantly - to network with other cleaners in their area to start pooling their resources. A place where cleaners could be people.

It's always sad to see seasoned vets leave a forum like this. Especially when the reason they give is that they aren't finding what they seek any more. People like Camacho give the new guys hope - yes, they CAN be that guy someday! Yes, they CAN run a successful carpet business, even in a city saturated with them! Yes, they CAN still have a sense of humor about it! Mike, and Six, and Pinosan, and a host of others have become legends not just in their own minds but to all of us who read their posts. Agree or disagree, like or dislike their approach, these guys know the business and aren't afraid to speak their minds about it.

The fewer examples like that these new guys have in their lives, the dimmer the overall light gets. And that's a light this industry needs.
 

rob allen

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