Loss of vacuum on long hose runs TM vs. Portable

[pgcleaner]

Lets assume for arguments sake. We have a TM and a porty. We measure the specs of both at the machine. Lets assume 2" diameter hose.

TM Specs: 200 CFM, 200" Lift
Porty Specs: 200 CFM, 200" Lift

(Reliabuilt's small TM and the Sandia Sniper (dual 3 stage) have similar specs)

We all know that with every 25' section of vacuum hose we loose suction.
If both units have the same specs at the machine, then they would have the same specs at 100' of vacuum hose. Vacuum degrades at the same rate per foot (assuming same hose diameter) once it leaves the machine.

So why do we assume the TM will perform better at 100' of hose than the porty? If they have similar specs at the machine, then they will have similar specs at the same hose run.

Thoughts anyone?

This seems like basic logic to me.

 

[OxiFreshGuy]

Because I dont assume. What the manual says vs my field experience is different.

Most of my residential runs require 150 ft of hose.

No gauges etc, just simply put my hand over the hose. Clearly a major difference between my mount and the portable.

Still a major difference at 100 ft.

Even at 50 ft there is still a difference.

Don't forget the heat a truck mount supplies conveniently.

Listen, I can clean with a portable and do a damn good job. I can simply do it faster and more conveniently with less labor using my TM.

 

[pgcleaner]

Because I dont assume. What the manual says vs my field experience is different.

Most of my residential runs require 150 ft of hose.

No gauges etc, just simply put my hand over the hose. Clearly a major difference between my mount and the portable.

Still a major difference at 100 ft.

Even at 50 ft there is still a difference.

Don't forget the heat a truck mount supplies conveniently.

Listen, I can clean with a portable and do a damn good job. I can simply do it faster and more conveniently with less labor using my TM.

 

[pgcleaner]

Are the specs the same for both your porty and your TM at each machine?

 

[pgcleaner]

I think you may have missed the point.

 

[OxiFreshGuy]

Well to be fair, my mount is an Apex 570 and my porty is a Mytee Vortex Lite.

I dont have any experience with a Reliability TM. But only 200 CFM seems awfully weak even for entry level TM.

I also know porty specs are suspicious as hell and don't get the same reading in real world scenarios.

 

[pgcleaner]

Well to be fair, my mount is an Apex 570 and my porty is a Mytee Vortex Lite.

I dont have any experience with a Reliability TM. But only 200 CFM seems awfully weak even for entry level TM.

I also know porty specs are suspicious as hell and don't get the same reading in real world scenarios.

Good to know! It's an interesting thoight experiment. How do you like your Vortex Lite? How long of a hose run can you use?

 

[Fedri]

To answer your question, if both are the same cfm and same lift, in this case, I don't see why a tm can beat a port in suction however, the heat the tm will produce will give out better results, and the setup time will be quicker.

I got an etm that I don't miss a tm at all. Total of 3 vacs 380 cfm according to the manufacturers specs of the vacs 144 lift, little giant heater, a generator to power it up and a decent pump rated at 2.2 GPM. Why do I still need a tm? My system is cheaper to maintain, as well. Strong enough to break a cfm reader.

 

[pgcleaner]

To answer your question, if both are the same cfm and same lift, in this case, I don't see why a tm can beat a port in suction however, the heat the tm will produce will give out better results, and the setup time will be quicker.

I got an etm that I don't miss a tm at all. Total of 3 vacs 380 cfm according to the manufacturers specs of the vacs 144 lift, little giant heater, a generator to power it up and a decent pump rated at 2.2 GPM. Why do I still need a tm? My system is cheaper to maintain, as well. Strong enough to break a cfm reader.

Which ETM?

 

[Fedri]

Which ETM?

I have a mytee machine with dual 5.7 vacs and a booster to add more CFM.

 

[pgcleaner]

I have a mytee machine with dual 5.7 vacs and a booster to add more CFM.

How long of a hose run can you do with that set up?

 

[Fedri]

How long of a hose run can you do with that set up?

250 plus feet. I have done 200 ft and still had massive suction another 50 feet easily.

 

[nathan hess]

This was discussed years ago in a thread on this forum titled CFM vs LIFT. I think the real issue is yest the portable can move 200 cfm but not under a large load. I believe it is similar to the horsepower vs torque theory. The truckmount supercharger is a sealed bladed unit not allowing leakage and therefor has more rated lift. The portable normally has a squirrel cage blower. When a load is applied (restriction) to the portable, the drive motor spins faster. When a load is applied to the truckmount, the load cause the engine to slowdown or activate the governor to maintain speed. If not for the vacuum popoff valve the engine would stall. The truckmount blower needs 10+ hp to operate properly. This is not practical with a portable. You would need access to 240 volts at an amperage of 30-50 amps to sustain the 10 hp electric motor driving a rotor style vacuum/ blower. Don Garletts is quotes as saying there's no replacement for displacement. The portable is a bunch of small spoons moving fast. The vacuum blower is a giant spoon moving slower but has 10hp behind it and minimal leakage.

 

[Prowler]

I have the Sandia 80-3500H with a Mytee 7300 LX II Air Hog booster. Gives the power of a small truck mount. With a 2" hose can go 150 ft no problem. Lots of power. Most places I cleaned use less than 150 ft of hoses. Uses 4 cords but has some heat with steam. Will take about a 10 or 12k generator to run it. Less Expensive than a gas truck mount, cheaper to operate and less maintenance.

 

[pgcleaner]

I have a mytee machine with dual 5.7 vacs and a booster to add more CFM.

After 18 months with a TM, the downtime it has caused is making me consider the etm life. My average run is 150 feet.

 

[OxiFreshGuy]

After 18 months with a TM, the downtime it has caused is making me consider the etm life. My average run is 150 feet.

What downtime issues are you having? I've had my mount for 3 years and no major issues outside of a minor coolant leak. Down time was all of 1 day.

 

[pgcleaner]

What downtime issues are you having? I've had my mount for 3 years and no major issues outside of a minor coolant leak. Down time was all of 1 day.

Heat exchangers, gages, issue with motor sensors.

 

[Fedri]

After 18 months with a TM, the downtime it has caused is making me consider the etm life. My average run is 150 feet.

Well sorry to hear about your down times that sucks. I don't have any down time at all. Because I can repair almost every thing by myself and I have a back up machine as well. The mytee LX vacs will give you 150 ft of hose or the rotovav Mansoon. Lately I prefer the mansoon over the mytee because mytee machines will have electrical issues. The switches will burn easily. I mean it takes less than 5 min to Chang a switch but still that's annoying if that happens every couple of months. Also you need a generator to power the etm so it feels like a TM with the little giant heater.

 

[pgcleaner]

Well sorry to hear about your down times that sucks. I don't have any down time at all. Because I can repair almost every thing by myself and I have a back up machine as well. The mytee LX vacs will give you 150 ft of hose or the rotovav Mansoon. Lately I prefer the mansoon over the mytee because mytee machines will have electrical issues. The switches will burn easily. I mean it takes less than 5 min to Chang a switch but still that's annoying if that happens every couple of months. Also you need a generator to power the etm so it feels like a TM with the little giant heater.

This is why I am considering the etm life.
I like the Vortex lite, because I do a fair amount of high rise work.

 

[mrotto]

and next you will be doing VLM....