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BigPapa

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Apr 11, 2013
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Dan Ziegler
#1
Truck mount, porty, crb, 175 ...I do not care...If you can not sell yourself, what does it matter.
" you will always find the money, before you find the sacrifice "...You read that right...Some one believes in you, way beyond you believe in yourself.
Suck it up buttercup...LOL...Hey...If those that love you, believe in you, just maybe you should too.
Listen...Close..." hook the fish, before you land it "...LOL

If ...I was to be honest...Your mind set wiil drive you. or...Make or Break you...So...as a young cleaner or an old leaner...Take this to heart.
 

Jim Davisson

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#2
It truly is. I promise you that you DO NOT need hot water to clean carpets exceptionally well anymore. Chemistry is light years ahead of when I started and temperature is only in the cleaners head anymore. I dare anybody to use todays proper chemistry and clean carpets with tap water and tell me what happens.... They turn out fabulous with out lava hot water, it's amazing!
 

Todd the Cleaner

Todd Cottino
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#3
It truly is. I promise you that you DO NOT need hot water to clean carpets exceptionally well anymore. Chemistry is light years ahead of when I started and temperature is only in the cleaners head anymore. I dare anybody to use todays proper chemistry and clean carpets with tap water and tell me what happens.... They turn out fabulous with out lava hot water, it's amazing!
Heat is definitely over rated. I clean with 160-170 degree water all day every day and never have a problem. All the high heat does is cause all kinds of problems with equipment and exploding hoses. Here’s a Chineese restaurant I clean every 3 months using 160 degree water.

43A1ED38-1697-491C-ABD7-3202525278A4.jpeg
 

sbsscn

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Sep 17, 2009
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Arm Ben
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#4
I love the heat, But its not necessary to use scalding hot water. Hot water is best for drying, But if the environment is right drying will occur, just remember you need a warm air temperature, air circulation and ventilation (think drying clothes)
 

sbsscn

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#5
I personally like 170 max I dont find using higher temps helps.
If your are using Enzymes they do work best with hot NOT Boiling but hot water.
 

Fedri

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Jan 25, 2015
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Fedri Irsat
#6
I am also around 160-170 cleaning temperature, that's all I got any way lol, good to hear I am not missing much with higher temperatures.
 

Luky

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Nov 29, 2013
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#7
Heat is definitely over rated. I clean with 160-170 degree water all day every day and never have a problem. All the high heat does is cause all kinds of problems with equipment and exploding hoses. Here’s a Chineese restaurant I clean every 3 months using 160 degree water.

View attachment 79971
I have no problem with Jim's and comment of yours , when you adjust chemistry to your liking and level
Heat is definitely over rated. I clean with 160-170 degree water all day every day and never have a problem. All the high heat does is cause all kinds of problems with equipment and exploding hoses. Here’s a Chineese restaurant I clean every 3 months using 160 degree water.

View attachment 79971
I do respect yours and Jim's expertise.....I do have some locations on 3 weeks cycle, but I wouldn't dare show up with tap water. You tell me....
My answer is: right chemistry, agitation and heat...
We can debate this topic all night long, as we always do, the matter of truth is that you have to always use method which suits each individual case. . If heat is so overrated, why don't we all get rid of heat exchangers( their expensive, tend to cause a lot of problems and they're heavy).LG's?
Forget it.
Whenever we talk about these issues, somehow we forget to mention that less heat is o.k. with light to medium soiled carpeting and is essential to a heavily soiled surface. There is a difference between various types of soils,,even though methods how to suspend it, might be quite similar.
I don't want new guys get an idea that they can show up in 10K Sqf commercial location with a dual 3 stage portable and expect to finish it in 3 hours while performing double bubble( dual wanding). This is not realistic. We often find ourselves in situations when we wish to have magic wand , so we can fix trashed, neglected carpeting that wasn't cleaned for 8- 10 years. Let's use 2 oz of anything in inline sprayer, rake it and extract with a 90° tap water( unfortunately some won't get any hotter).
Despite of what I said, I wholeheartedly agree with saying that man behind machine is what really matters....
 

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Todd the Cleaner

Todd Cottino
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Todd Cottino
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#8
I have no problem with Jim's and comment of yours , when you adjust chemistry to your liking and level

I do respect yours and Jim's expertise.....I do have some locations on 3 weeks cycle, but I wouldn't dare show up with tap water. You tell me....
My answer is: right chemistry, agitation and heat...
We can debate this topic all night long, as we always do, the matter of truth is that you have to always use method which suits each individual case. . If heat is so overrated, why don't we all get rid of heat exchangers( their expensive, tend to cause a lot of problems and they're heavy).LG's?
Forget it.
Whenever we talk about these issues, somehow we forget to mention that less heat is o.k. with light to medium soiled carpeting and is essential to a heavily soiled surface. There is a difference between various types of soils,,even though methods how to suspend it, might be quite similar.
I don't want new guys get an idea that they can show up in 10K Sqf commercial location with a dual 3 stage portable and expect to finish it in 3 hours while performing double bubble( dual wanding). This is not realistic. We often find ourselves in situations when we wish to have magic wand , so we can fix trashed, neglected carpeting that wasn't cleaned for 8- 10 years. Let's use 2 oz of anything in inline sprayer, rake it and extract with a 90° tap water( unfortunately some won't get any hotter).
Despite of what I said, I wholeheartedly agree with saying that man behind machine is what really matters....
To each his own on how much heat they want. I’ve had fire breathing truckmounts (literally, my last diesel burner truckmount caught on fire!). I’ve also had heat exchanger truckmounts that put out 240. Honestly the added problems of wand triggers constantly going out, hoses constantly wearing out, all the headache of all the sensors, switches, & bypasses on the truckmount, problems with the hot solution hose literally making creases in the carpet, the list of problems goes on and on that is caused by high heat.

Is there a benefit to high heat? Sure there is, but the trade off is not worth it to me. Honestly I can get the carpet every bit as clean with 160 degree water as I can with 240 degree water. I know some guys have to have the biggest, hottest, fanciest machine out there and that’s fine with me. To each their own.
 

Luky

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Nov 29, 2013
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Marian Lukacisin
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#9
To each his own on how much heat they want. I’ve had fire breathing truckmounts (literally, my last diesel burner truckmount caught on fire!). I’ve also had heat exchanger truckmounts that put out 240. Honestly the added problems of wand triggers constantly going out, hoses constantly wearing out, all the headache of all the sensors, switches, & bypasses on the truckmount, problems with the hot solution hose literally making creases in the carpet, the list of problems goes on and on that is caused by high heat.

Is there a benefit to high heat? Sure there is, but the trade off is not worth it to me. Honestly I can get the carpet every bit as clean with 160 degree water as I can with 240 degree water. I know some guys have to have the biggest, hottest, fanciest machine out there and that’s fine with me. To each their own.
I know that your being you, always a diplomat and gentle giant.. I don't clean wit a 230°-240° either. The temperature of tap water is in between 50°-60°, heaters should be set at 120°, I believe in restaurants they reach 140°( learned it hard way). If you using 160° , you believe that higher temp will provide satisfactory results. You accomplish it with a heat exchangers of some type or heating source, propane or diesel. I too Am believer of utilizing heat as a part of cleaning pie. I set my heater to 190°, I'm 30° higher compare to you, but 40° lower from what you saying is extreme 240°. Is there anybody using 260°-270° hot water? 100% . I'm not sure they'll brag about it , maybe they will. For sure, they won't have problem melting chewing gum instantly. Well, I'm sure that you know what my point is...
It's like saying that I can clean better with my porty than the guy with a truckmount. To understand limitations and advantages of your equipment will bring you desired results. And if you get better results with your porty spending same time, guy with a TM is a moron, who has no idea where the pressure regulator,is what hot box stands for, if cover on the waste tank has a proper insulation, etc.
Procedure with a TM: Open the side and back doors for proper ventilation, start your engine. While engine is huffing and puffing, you start unwinding 100-150' of solution hose taking it to the farthest point of the house. Come back to the van, adjust rpm's and start prespraying. We're assuming that at this point you already done walkthrough, protected the floors and positioned the corner buddies all over the house. You praised the owner for their taste in latest desing trends and complimented their "awesome" pets.
You'll emerge after 1- 1/2 hours and start breaking down ...
I'm praying that Jeff and rest of the pack are busy and will not chime in. This is for new wave of the cleaners, who will need to find their weakness before gaining some of needed strength....
 
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Jim Davisson

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Aug 23, 2016
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#10
When I prespray with the TM even with 175°+ temps how much heat is lost between the jet 18" off the floor. In less than 1 min the carpet fibers are room temperature and should dwell for at least another 10-15 minutes. How much HEAT was working here? IMO not much, the chems are doing the heavy lifting along with agitation at about room temperature in that time. Rinsing with high heat on a small percentage of jobs is definitely a bonus especially if agitation is skipped. I know my honesty aggravates folks but I've purposely cleaned jobs down the middle of the room hot and cold water and I couldn't tell the difference. The only industry I can think of that recommends using hot water to actually rinse is ours. Cold water rinses faster with less residue in that given time when I wash dishes or anything else for that matter. Since I use both TM's and portables it looks like I'm hatin on TM's, I'm not. I just had to be honest with myself after actually testing where all this heat was supposedly working, because after the chems and agitation most all carpets look really, really good before extraction... So there's that.
 

Ken Raddon

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Jul 22, 2010
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#11
I got my opinions about all that too. They are inline with Todd's but "can not" is spelled "cannot"
 

Ymetimme

Active Member
Apr 27, 2018
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Tim yeater
#12
I do have to agree you do not need incredible Heat to clean carpet. Oh boy is it nice on those insanely nasty greases jobs hey turn the dial on Little Giant all the way up. And the fact is I would give up any heat to keep the chemistry. Chemistry is far more valuable. I also feel the agitation is far more valuable. Now I'm not going to give up my heat but I clean for years without it and it work just fine.
 

BigPapa

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Apr 11, 2013
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Dan Ziegler
#13
The humidity factor comes in to play at a higher level with heat...What are your thoughts on that?
 

Anderson

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Aug 16, 2006
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Belton Texas
#14
gotta disagree with the porty vs tm......

this is what cleans:
heat
vacuum
scrubbing - 175 or crb
pressure -- water flow

if any of these are missing you can diminish cleaning greatly....not just a small percent

those of us that have done a little pressure washing know the difference......
i have tried pressure washing with a walmart 1.5 gallon....took 4 hours to do a driveway...
these pressure washer guys can knock out a drive way in 20 minutes......
they use 5 gpm deisil heat and blast it out......

same with carpet cleaning...the key is water flow......
you can only have water flow depending on vacuum and heat....are you will overwert carpet....


i can clean with my TM what 4-5 portys can clean in the same time.....
accept on homes

.....
my main business is commercial....cant clean with a porty...i have tried.....
i clean resturants, theaters, . hotels, tile and upholstery.
...these cannot be cleaned with a porty....imo
maybe hotels??? and tile?????
 

Jim Davisson

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Aug 23, 2016
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#15
Bigpapa, ambient humidity definitely increases with high heat. Depending on where in the country you clean it will have an impact on dry times. Here in the Carolinas for 8 months a year it is extremely humid. I vented the pet treatment I did first thing this morning before I left since, it was less humid outside even on the leeward side of the hurricane. In the winter our dry times are fantastic, the rest of the year one slow dry stroke at a minimum.
 
Jun 15, 2018
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Thunder Warren
#16
Heat may not be necessary but it sure is nice. Has physics changed? Does the activity in the cleaning agents not accelerate as the temperature goes up? It allows for faster dry time too. I started with a portable and would not use the external heater because it made no difference. But when I got real heat with my truck mount, I changed my tune.
 

OldCarpetVet

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Nov 2, 2014
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Richard Santoro
#17
My .02.
Forget the fact that I'm old school.
Until certain truck mount manufactures came along with their agenda, pushing their You Need It heat exchangers, there was only 3 pieces to the cleaning equation pie.
1)- Chemical Action.
2)- Mechanical Action
3)- Compentcy Of The Operator.

It is my opinion that that still holds true to this day. I ONLY cleaned with warm water and consistently achieved outstanding results. And I taught others to clean the same way so they too achieved outstanding results. Was I always perfect? No. But who is? And the lack of heat had nothing to do with the final results of those basket case jobs I'm referring to. And now with todays spectacular chemistry!
Pfffft. Fugitaboudit. Easy peasy.
So I concur 100% completely with Jim D.
 

1ST CHOICE CLEANING

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jason fisher
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#18
My .02.
Forget the fact that I'm old school.
Until certain truck mount manufactures came along with their agenda, pushing their You Need It heat exchangers, there was only 3 pieces to the cleaning equation pie.
1)- Chemical Action.
2)- Mechanical Action
3)- Compentcy Of The Operator.

It is my opinion that that still holds true to this day. I ONLY cleaned with warm water and consistently achieved outstanding results. And I taught others to clean the same way so they too achieved outstanding results. Was I always perfect? No. But who is? And the lack of heat had nothing to do with the final results of those basket case jobs I'm referring to. And now with todays spectacular chemistry!
Pfffft. Fugitaboudit. Easy peasy.
So I concur 100% completely with Jim D.
Agree 100%. I have 2 TM's, one with the heat exchanger bypassed and it still manages to heat the water up to about the temp of tap water and my newer one that has duel HX's and will get well over 200 and the end results are the same as far as cleaning. When my van was down and I had to use my old original TM none of my customers knew the difference including my repeat customers. For image purpose I prefer the newer shinny TM that creates steam but at the end of the day they both clean the same.
 

ACP

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Apr 9, 2014
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Bjorn Marshall
#19
cold water can work fine.... but the point you might be missing is its in the customers head just as much as cleaners...

we market the true steam cleaning, it sets us apart from every other 150 carpet cleaners they can choose from who are using luke warm water.

we show high temps in our videos etc... trust me it works.

 

Jim Davisson

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Aug 23, 2016
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James Davisson
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#20
50% of the jobs on my truck are portable. At best I can get 120-130° out of the sink (harder to directly hook to a pull out kitchen faucet, I can but it's not worth the time). With the machine inside at 50-75' of hose, good chems, 1.75 GPM flow and 210-220 CFM at the wand, speed isn't a problem and neither is heat. With this simple setup I'm prespraying in under 5 mins with the most heat that job has to offer. It can overrun down the drain as needed and help flush the apo efflient and barely stays full under full triggering with the faucet wide open. Will this portable hang with a TM, all day long.
20180830_121112.jpg
100 oz container
 

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