Hybrid Truck Mount Phase 2b Report | TruckMount Forums #1 Carpet Cleaning Forums

Hybrid Truck Mount Phase 2b Report

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
Current Configuration:

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator
Total Watts: 5340 - 66% of running watts of generator

New Configuration (phase b):

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
1 old porty case running a 96" 2 - stage (Windsor) vacuum motor sucking off the exhaust port of the lead Air Hog. - Using 1050 watts
Total Watts: 6390 - right at 80% of running watts of generator
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator

When testing this (twice now) I see some performance improvement with the 2 stage sucking off the exhaust. My lift (on a Pumptec gauge) goes from about 205 to about 230 (lift measured between both hogs running parallel with only one actually being exhaust boosted). However I'm considering either ditching this or adding another 2 stage to increase my total boost and add another 700 watts. If I ditch the exhaust boosting idea I might add a 3rd Air Hog to the chain but my watts used would approach 7500 (out of 8000 running watts) which I don't know if this would create a random low voltage situation for the motors running on it since the generator would be "taxed." I might order a custom made pump from Cobb that only uses 3 amps just to allow a 3rd hog - my assumption is that more cfm with another hog in parallel will beat exhaust boosting any day.
 

tonyb14

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2013
2,658
974
113
48
Hazleton
www.steamteamcarpetcleaningnepa.com
Real Name
Tony Burke
Business Location
United States
Current Configuration:

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator
Total Watts: 5340 - 66% of running watts of generator

New Configuration (phase b):

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
1 old porty case running a 96" 2 - stage (Windsor) vacuum motor sucking off the exhaust port of the lead Air Hog. - Using 1050 watts
Total Watts: 6390 - right at 80% of running watts of generator
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator

When testing this (twice now) I see some performance improvement with the 2 stage sucking off the exhaust. My lift (on a Pumptec gauge) goes from about 205 to about 230 (lift measured between both hogs running parallel with only one actually being exhaust boosted). However I'm considering either ditching this or adding another 2 stage to increase my total boost and add another 700 watts. If I ditch the exhaust boosting idea I might add a 3rd Air Hog to the chain but my watts used would approach 7500 (out of 8000 running watts) which I don't know if this would create a random low voltage situation for the motors running on it since the generator would be "taxed." I might order a custom made pump from Cobb that only uses 3 amps just to allow a 3rd hog - my assumption is that more cfm with another hog in parallel will beat exhaust boosting any day.
You seem to have a lot of knowledge about this stuff.. I have some questions is you don't mind answering them.

The set up I have now is a galaxy 500 psi with duel 3 stage vacs and a strap on 2000 watt heater. I have both running to a champion 9500 watt generator ( I don't like using customers power and risk popping breakers).
I would love to add an air hog and turn this into a etm/htm and work strictly from the van. So here's the questions.

1. How can I do this lol?
2. I notice in one of your pics you use a fresh water tank.. How does that water get pumped from the tank?
3. I don't think the heater I'm using is very good, do you have any info on alternate heat sources?
4. Is there a big difference in using 1 1/2 hose compared to 2"? ( I have 100ft 1 1/2" now)
5. What's a htm? I know etm is electric truck mount.
Thanks for any info!!
 

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
You seem to have a lot of knowledge about this stuff.. I have some questions is you don't mind answering them.

The set up I have now is a galaxy 500 psi with duel 3 stage vacs and a strap on 2000 watt heater. I have both running to a champion 9500 watt generator ( I don't like using customers power and risk popping breakers).
I would love to add an air hog and turn this into a etm/htm and work strictly from the van. So here's the questions.

1. How can I do this lol?
2. I notice in one of your pics you use a fresh water tank.. How does that water get pumped from the tank?
3. I don't think the heater I'm using is very good, do you have any info on alternate heat sources?
4. Is there a big difference in using 1 1/2 hose compared to 2"? ( I have 100ft 1 1/2" now)
5. What's a htm? I know etm is electric truck mount.
Thanks for any info!!

With a Galaxy dual 3 stage you should be ok on power if you add an AH-7300-S - it should be a good combination - both with similar 3 stage vacs. You would run both in your van with about a 2 ft 2" hose (or so) between - keeping the hose as straight as possible to prevent adding an unnecessary turbulence.

The fresh water tank uses a transfer pump which feeds the water hog. The water hog requires this but the pump in the Galaxy will suction feed from a water tank - I bought mine at Tractor Supply Store - cheap.

The best alternative heat source is adding an hx to your generator. I'm still trying to figure out the best way to do this and am now talking to Cobb Carpet about a custom hx - the challenge with a hx running off your generator is that it will build up some serious heat which requires some sort of solenoid or Murphy gauge to unload heat when it builds to long. Inline heaters won't do very well with a cold water source like a water tank - I'm using a 3600 watt heater at the customers site now but it doesn't get very hot when the source is cold.

2" hose is the way to go - You have 4x more turbulence with 1 1/2" hose which makes a huge difference after just a few feet. Going 100' with 1 1/2" hose is like going about 200' with 2" hose

Hybrid Truck Mount - same guts as an ETM hooked up to generator.
 
  • Like
Reactions: StevenB.

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
Current Configuration:

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator
Total Watts: 5340 - 66% of running watts of generator

New Configuration (phase b):

2 Air Hog 7300-S - Using 4300 watts combined (one has apo enabled)
1 Water Hog - Using 1040 watts at 400-500 psi (carpet mode)
1 old porty case running a 96" 2 - stage (Windsor) vacuum motor sucking off the exhaust port of the lead Air Hog. - Using 1050 watts
Total Watts: 6390 - right at 80% of running watts of generator
8000 Running Watt / 10,000 peak Generac Generator

When testing this (twice now) I see some performance improvement with the 2 stage sucking off the exhaust. My lift (on a Pumptec gauge) goes from about 205 to about 230 (lift measured between both hogs running parallel with only one actually being exhaust boosted). However I'm considering either ditching this or adding another 2 stage to increase my total boost and add another 700 watts. If I ditch the exhaust boosting idea I might add a 3rd Air Hog to the chain but my watts used would approach 7500 (out of 8000 running watts) which I don't know if this would create a random low voltage situation for the motors running on it since the generator would be "taxed." I might order a custom made pump from Cobb that only uses 3 amps just to allow a 3rd hog - my assumption is that more cfm with another hog in parallel will beat exhaust boosting any day.

Ran the new config again today - with the extra exhaust boost. Seems to lock down on the carpet better and interestingly enough I get no hose drip and way less water in the bottom of the lint hog so I'm guessing cfm's are maintained better along with a slight cfm boost. This weekend I'm going to be testing this on a 200' run at a clients office building to see how it performs at it's maximum "reasonable" vacuum hose run. Before with just 2 Air Hogs it would have less pop at 200' and the wand would get quiet (less air flow) the moment the lint hog filter started to get dirty - we'll see if this makes 200 a little more practical.
 

tonyb14

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2013
2,658
974
113
48
Hazleton
www.steamteamcarpetcleaningnepa.com
Real Name
Tony Burke
Business Location
United States
Thanks for all the info Jim... I really appreciate it!!!
I had no idea 1 1/2 to 2" made such a difference.
I'm still a little confused how the galaxy would get the water from a fresh tank. Does a fresh water tank have something you just connect your machine to?
 

StevenB.

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2012
4,966
2,201
113
58
Wheatland,Ca.
www.stevescarpetcare.com
Real Name
Steve Baker
Business Location
United States
Would the parallel Air hog play well with your setup. I have an additional exhaust port over the sreies model as I understand. Would that provide any benefit/hindrance?
 

StevenB.

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2012
4,966
2,201
113
58
Wheatland,Ca.
www.stevescarpetcare.com
Real Name
Steve Baker
Business Location
United States
Thanks for all the info Jim... I really appreciate it!!!
I had no idea 1 1/2 to 2" made such a difference.
I'm still a little confused how the galaxy would get the water from a fresh tank. Does a fresh water tank have something you just connect your machine to?
It makes a huge difference. I was skeptical about the benefits on a 2 vac porty. I was wrong to be skeptical:)
 

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
Thanks for all the info Jim... I really appreciate it!!!
I had no idea 1 1/2 to 2" made such a difference.
I'm still a little confused how the galaxy would get the water from a fresh tank. Does a fresh water tank have something you just connect your machine to?
You would just redirect the solution line which is hooked up to the bottom of your tank to the external solution tank.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using TMF Forums mobile app
 

Mojo Rising

Premium VIP
May 26, 2012
9,999
2,456
113
Bend
Real Name
REal NAme
My personal favorite is..

engine powering a pd blower and a pump..

A lot less to write too ;)
 

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
My personal favorite is..

engine powering a pd blower and a pump..

A lot less to write too ;)
I have 2 Panthers doing just that... My 3rd TM or HTM is to see if I can create a powerful alternative. With 3 AH-7300S and a hx I'll have more power then a 20 hp TM while only using 7000 watts running off an 8000 watt 14hp gen using less then a gallon an hour. If I can accomplish this then I'm happy and have produced more power then my 18hp Panther... Pretty cool. About 400 cfm and 16" lift

Sent from my SGH-T679 using TMF Forums mobile app
 
  • Like
Reactions: StevenB.

DJCarpetService

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2011
1,540
600
113
PA
Real Name
Jared Benedict
Business Location
United States
I have 2 Panthers doing just that... My 3rd TM or HTM is to see if I can create a powerful alternative. With 3 AH-7300S and a hx I'll have more power then a 20 hp TM while only using 7000 watts running off an 8000 watt 14hp gen using less then a gallon an hour. If I can accomplish this then I'm happy and have produced more power then my 18hp Panther... Pretty cool. About 400 cfm and 16" lift

Sent from my SGH-T679 using TMF Forums mobile app

Why don't you just use the panther up to 150' and if you have a longer run take the porty within 100' of the area you are cleaning?

I like how much work you are putting into your experiments, but I really don't understand the need for X amount of vacuums or XXXX watt generator when you can simply use your TM and if the hose run is too long take out the porty..

I'm not criticizing your approach, I'm just wondering what your goal is to achieve
 

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
Why don't you just use the panther up to 150' and if you have a longer run take the porty within 100' of the area you are cleaning?

I like how much work you are putting into your experiments, but I really don't understand the need for X amount of vacuums or XXXX watt generator when you can simply use your TM and if the hose run is too long take out the porty..

I'm not criticizing your approach, I'm just wondering what your goal is to achieve
Usually I go up to 250' with the Panther max - normally if I'm having to go about 200' and have easy access for one of my Eclipse porties (like elevators, etc) I'll just say screw it and bring the "porty van" and not bother with running 2" hose excessive distance. However, during the summer "turn" I will do several apartment buildings - 3 floors - with a TM - hitting about 80 per building in a day - running 200-300' of hose - across the balcony - through apartment 1 - across the hall to apartment 2 - down the hall to apartment 3 - etc. With these type of complexes they need it done fast (for move-ins) and are TM only scenarios. These are cases where I really begin to understand the importance of cranking up the cfm's - even with my HTM I need it to do at least 200' so it can be productive member of my TM family. :) For example I have both Panthers tied up this weekend - doing some commercial work in Birmingham so I have to use my HTM Sunday to do a large client that has a massive amount of very dirty cgc that would make a porty piss on itself - I will have to run about 200'.

Long story short I run into situations that need a TM (or require by the customer) with 200+ runs and need to make sure I can do this will all my TMs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: StevenB.

Jim Ellis

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2013
1,067
279
83
49
Tuscaloosa, Alabama
www.instantsteamclean.com
Real Name
Jim Ellis
Business Location
United States
Anyway - think about it - 400 cfm with a HTM - 7,000 watts and .75 gallons of gas per hour with a hx - this is "Phase III" and will be coming soon. The total cost will less then my 18hp Panther and about the same as my less powerful 14hp Panther - more cfm then either with 16" of lift. The heat will only be as good as my 14hp Panther since my generator is 14hp but it's still very impressive. More food for thought - If I add 2 mytee 302la motors on a mounting bracket instead of a 3rd AH then I have the same power boost for far less money. In fact - forget whether it's an Air Hog - and focus on the vacuum motors - see list below:

All pairs of motors below are in a series config:

4 3 stage 302la - 260 cfm 16" lift - 4100 watts
4 3 stage 302la - 260 cfm 16" lift - 4100 watts
1 pump - 400 watts
1 hx - heat - 0 watts

Total watts 8600
Total Lift 16"
Total cfm - 520

If you put together the vacs yourself you are looking at a cost of about $3700 counting a 10,000 running watt generator. I'm going to stop for a while at 6 3-stage vac motors but down the road I might push it to 8...
 

DJCarpetService

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2011
1,540
600
113
PA
Real Name
Jared Benedict
Business Location
United States
Usually I go up to 250' with the Panther max - normally if I'm having to go about 200' and have easy access for one of my Eclipse porties (like elevators, etc) I'll just say screw it and bring the "porty van" and not bother with running 2" hose excessive distance. However, during the summer "turn" I will do several apartment buildings - 3 floors - with a TM - hitting about 80 per building in a day - running 200-300' of hose - across the balcony - through apartment 1 - across the hall to apartment 2 - down the hall to apartment 3 - etc. With these type of complexes they need it done fast (for move-ins) and are TM only scenarios. These are cases where I really begin to understand the importance of cranking up the cfm's - even with my HTM I need it to do at least 200' so it can be productive member of my TM family. :) For example I have both Panthers tied up this weekend - doing some commercial work in Birmingham so I have to use my HTM Sunday to do a large client that has a massive amount of very dirty cgc that would make a porty piss on itself - I will have to run about 200'.

Long story short I run into situations that need a TM (or require by the customer) with 200+ runs and need to make sure I can do this will all my TMs.

Good Luck with your set up, I hope you get it performing the way you need it...I am clueless about the porty world, which is mainly the reason I jumped in this thread... I have a ski resort that my TM can do about 90% of the condos, but there is one section of condos that are roughly 300' from the parking lot... I am thinking of buying a porty for this along with any "just in case" situations..

Do you have any suggestions for portys?.. Maybe a lower end model seeing how it would only be used a handful of times a year
 

DJCarpetService

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2011
1,540
600
113
PA
Real Name
Jared Benedict
Business Location
United States
Anyway - think about it - 400 cfm with a HTM - 7,000 watts and .75 gallons of gas per hour with a hx - this is "Phase III" and will be coming soon. The total cost will less then my 18hp Panther and about the same as my less powerful 14hp Panther - more cfm then either with 16" of lift. The heat will only be as good as my 14hp Panther since my generator is 14hp but it's still very impressive. More food for thought - If I add 2 mytee 302la motors on a mounting bracket instead of a 3rd AH then I have the same power boost for far less money. In fact - forget whether it's an Air Hog - and focus on the vacuum motors - see list below:

All pairs of motors below are in a series config:

4 3 stage 302la - 260 cfm 16" lift - 4100 watts
4 3 stage 302la - 260 cfm 16" lift - 4100 watts
1 pump - 400 watts
1 hx - heat - 0 watts

Total watts 8600
Total Lift 16"
Total cfm - 520

If you put together the vacs yourself you are looking at a cost of about $3700 counting a 10,000 running watt generator. I'm going to stop for a while at 6 3-stage vac motors but down the road I might push it to 8...

You have my attention for sure.. I would love to see a pic of this setup.. How long are the vac motors usually good for? .. How did you work in the heat X to the generator and what temperatures are you getting from it.. What portable are you using as your pump/base for this setup
 

tonyb14

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2013
2,658
974
113
48
Hazleton
www.steamteamcarpetcleaningnepa.com
Real Name
Tony Burke
Business Location
United States
With a Galaxy dual 3 stage you should be ok on power if you add an AH-7300-S - it should be a good combination - both with similar 3 stage vacs. You would run both in your van with about a 2 ft 2" hose (or so) between - keeping the hose as straight as possible to prevent adding an unnecessary turbulence.

The fresh water tank uses a transfer pump which feeds the water hog. The water hog requires this but the pump in the Galaxy will suction feed from a water tank - I bought mine at Tractor Supply Store - cheap.

The best alternative heat source is adding an hx to your generator. I'm still trying to figure out the best way to do this and am now talking to Cobb Carpet about a custom hx - the challenge with a hx running off your generator is that it will build up some serious heat which requires some sort of solenoid or Murphy gauge to unload heat when it builds to long. Inline heaters won't do very well with a cold water source like a water tank - I'm using a 3600 watt heater at the customers site now but it doesn't get very hot when the source is cold.

2" hose is the way to go - You have 4x more turbulence with 1 1/2" hose which makes a huge difference after just a few feet. Going 100' with 1 1/2" hose is like going about 200' with 2" hose

Hybrid Truck Mount - same guts as an ETM hooked up to generator.
I'm really interested in seeing how you make out with the generator hx. I would love to be able to get more heat than my 2000w strap on.... Keep me posted please.