Deadly presprays

[Adrean]

I clean rugs and upholstery and majority of the rugs I clean are wool, so I am using wool safe products. But even on the synthetic rugs I clean I will sometimes use wool shampoos on them unless they are really dirty or have pet urine. But because I am submering rugs I will get urine out without having to use a lot of presprays or strong pet urine products, however I will use a sanitizer after washing them. Most of my clients have kids and pet so I try to use a green product as well as. Cost a little more, but my clients have come to expect it.

 

[Scott W]

Since GHS came into affect, the SDs have gotten scarier looking. Many more pictograms are required. Specific signal words and warnings are required since the SDS must now meet the strictest standards of all the various countries in the world that are part of GHS.

As long as the person writing the SDS understands how they should be written, there will be some scary parts in any cleaning formula. But there are some SDS written by persons not trained on what they should warn against.

Two key points to be made.
#1 always use the products in a safe manner. Some folks are much more sensitive than others. That sensitive person could be us. Might be our helper. Might be one of our customers. What has never bothered us before might bother someone else nearby.

#2. Handle the concentrated products, mixing and diluting at your shop or in your van, not in the customers home. Thereby you don't expose anyone to an unnecessary risk. It also allows you to share the SDS for the diluted products with your customers if that is all they are ever exposed to. Those are less scary. Bridgepoint does provide SDS for the concentrated products and the diluted versions.

 

[Madenman]

I’d like you to go creep on someone else.

I have to point out this was an extremely unprofessional response to some one putting INFORMATION out there without an opinion.

 

[AZHome&Carpet]

I’m not the smartest guy in a room ever, and maybe my dad taught me wrong. But why do people find it even acceptable to come to another mans house and disrespect him?

 

[Tom Forsythe]

We have followed Prop 65 and have chosen not to use any ingredients on the list like N-methyl pyrolidone. However, now that coffee is on the Prop 65 list, the legitimacy of the list is now in question. When the view is that everything is listed (false conclusion) as a carcinogen then consumers (including cleaners) have a tendency to disregard the warning. There always needs to be some regulatory balance for them to be viewed legitimate.

California is obviously out of balance as symbolized by California's Prop 65 listing of coffee. I had some issue with stress about a decade ago and asked my doctor if my modest use of coffee was a concern. He happily delivered his 5 minute lecture on all of the ways that coffee was a health benefit when used moderately (under 4 cups a day). I believe the FDA is in the midst of developing a strong response to California's view of coffee.

 

[Madenman]

I’m not the smartest guy in a room ever, and maybe my dad taught me wrong. But why do people find it even acceptable to come to another mans house and disrespect him?

If Rib didn’t have skin in the game I think it would be one thing. But as someone that I purchase products from I expect a certain amount of professionalism. I love this Fourm and feel like there is so much to learn here but if someone particularly the owner is trying to say that information that doesn’t line up with his sales pitch is wrong or bad then how can we trust his products.

 

[BigPapa]

Forgive me Tom, but you seem to a man with some knowledge, and I am new here...When you have the time could you give me insight to your years to the cleaning industry?

 

[BigPapa]

If Rib didn’t have skin in the game I think it would be one thing. But as someone that I purchase products from I expect a certain amount of professionalism. I love this Fourm and feel like there is so much to learn here but if someone particularly the owner is trying to say that information that doesn’t line up with his sales pitch is wrong or bad then how can we trust his products.

It is OK...This internet "talk " can get confusing, You do not see the expressions in ones face, or hear the tone...Sometimes it can catch you and you become affended for no reason.
I have never met Rob, but in my readings of him, he's a firecracker...LOL

 

[Madenman]

Pardon my poor English, Is it that I said something you did not like or I'm not understanding your comment. Let me know and If I wrote something you did not like, I will elaborate further as it is not my intention to create discrepancies.

No I’m sorry I goofed the post up. I was rather upset with Robs negative comment about your large post explaining the language of sds sheets. I really appreciate that you took the time to explain that.

 

[rob allen]

I have to point out this was an extremely unprofessional response to some one putting INFORMATION out there without an opinion.

A few member trolls have an unusual obsession with me and my business. It was annoying over last couple years but now it’s just creepy.

 

[wandwizard]

We have followed Prop 65 and have chosen not to use any ingredients on the list like N-methyl pyrolidone. However, now that coffee is on the Prop 65 list, the legitimacy of the list is now in question. When the view is that everything is listed (false conclusion) as a carcinogen then consumers (including cleaners) have a tendency to disregard the warning. There always needs to be some regulatory balance for them to be viewed legitimate.

California is obviously out of balance as symbolized by California's Prop 65 listing of coffee. I had some issue with stress about a decade ago and asked my doctor if my modest use of coffee was a concern. He happily delivered his 5 minute lecture on all of the ways that coffee was a health benefit when used moderately (under 4 cups a day). I believe the FDA is in the midst of developing a strong response to California's view of coffee.

4 cups a day. Guess I'm good then! I'm on my second one right now. Most of what I've read and heard on coffee has been positive so I'll be having at least another cup today.

 

[AZHome&Carpet]

People sign up for a voluntary membership on a Internet forum and then bash the owner? I’m missing something, maybe I’m a bit too green here to understand.

 

[Joe cool]

Some encaps make you cough immediately and your customers dash out of the room

 

[sbsscn]

@rob allen
complete blindness
severe eye damage

Would you like us to expand on these descriptions?

Yes, Please continue

 

[sbsscn]

Information found on the SDS can not be used to determine 100% the level of toxicity in a given product. those only serve as a guide for first aid treatment. Those papers are worded by the manufacturer in a convenient and efficient way as to not scare the users. Some companies decide to just write it like it should be and some others choose a different set of words that convey the same message to the first aid team and organizations in charge of defining what the product can or cannot do to living creatures or plants.

lets see this description for example since it is one that Rob chose.

Causes skin corrosion

When one reads that in a given label one tends to get scared or at least, get more concerned as to what the product may do to you your clients or the environment.

Causes skin irritation

When one reads the above description things change. the way one feels about the product dramatically changes our perspective and the fears or concerns decrease a great deal.

And we all know that skin irritation is simply a more subtle way to let people know that the potential to skin corrosion does exist. Same thing different words.

In order for us to know exactly what the "dangers" will be we need to know the exact concentration and the required "environment" for the use of the product and also if there are other components that will diminish the effect of the reaction of a given ingredient during the formulation. Then and only then, we will be able to determine if its safe or if its not or if the allegations of "dangerous" about any given product hold true.

Now, I have taken as example the soap that we use to take showers and even to bathe our babies. All of this soaps are made with high concentrations of sodium Hydroxide. One of the most carcinogenic chemicals in the industry. Yet, we, all of us, use it everyday and we never ever worry about our safety or that of our children and babies. Heck, even, neutrogena soap bars are recommended by most dermatologist worldwide as the safest soaps to use.

Being this said, here is a picture of the SDS of a surfactant that Rob uses widely in almost all of his products. Read the description given by the master manufacturer of this surfactant and see for yourselves that the description on at least one of the ingredients of Robs products has the same effects as those of the other products in question. Does this mean Robs products are dangerous? Of course, but only as dangerous as the most of the products in the market and I'm sure those have been formulated to not put you at risk at any given moment as well as the others in question.

I hope this helps you guys to determine whether your products are as dangerous as the competitors tell you they are and if in doubt, call the technical support. They will be able to clear up your doubts and to better guide you on the proper use of the product. It is not only that you deserve it; it is the law.

Any question please post them here, I will answer them all to the best of my knowledge or I will get my formulators involved to help you guys make educated decisions when choosing products and using them.

PS I don't sell products I'm not a guru or Messiah I just happen to have been formulating with the collaboration of an experienced formulator and other students for over 5 years now.

good day.

Id like to know the name of this ingredient along with the rest

 

[sbsscn]

This stuff is important.
Last week someone from Fizzion tablets of carbon dioxide came in here promoting the stuff and claimed it was green, but kept using the "Eco friendly " term. I and others could not see how the product was green. The person kept insisting it was green, safe and non harmful and eco friendly and
provided a link to the products SDS.

I looked into it and found some horrible warning, toxic, harmful to unborn child, and harmful to reproduction system. i mean the sds said it was Toxic.

 

[Joe cool]

My pre spray says 100 % safe non toxic since 1969 .

 

[rob allen]

Oh ok no worries my friend and thank you. It’s just typical of him if one won’t praise him, he plays the victim and calls as many minions as possible to help him attack and insult others. I just can’t praise anyone, I’m a man of honor and won’t cover my mouth in brown just to fit in? I do have respect for him though and wish him good.

No victim here. You jump in anytime I post with weird remarks about me personally. My personal and your personal life is no concern of each others. Any crossing over is creeper territory.

 

[rob allen]

We both know is not the case. I never made remarks about your persona until two days ago when you called Johnny names.

It's nice to make others uncomfortable but not as nice when someone makes us feel uncomfortable that is for sure.

I'd say let's learn how to share the world and move on. And I repeat, If you want me gone, just tell me I'll leave or push the button yourself my friend. Believe me , I don't like being were I'm not wanted; unfortunately, There are a lot of people who appreciate my being here and feel that my comments are useful or amusing. I like spending time with them.

Have a good day now.

If you stay on topic I have zero issues. I never called him a name, rather a "prick in my side". It gets old when others who have a vendetta pry into my personal or business life. Just mind our own business and we will all be fine.

 

[rob allen]

Those are readily available in the sds read it.




I think some how you got all this twisted. my comments do not imply that any given product is toxic or poisonous; all the contrary.

the excerpt of the SDS I posted is not meant to suggest that Rob's product that includes the ingredient is a bad or dangerous product. It was simply to reinforce my comments about the products that have those straight forward descriptions may not be as dangerous as Rob perceived those could be.

Here are some highlights for you to better understand my comments.

Do not rely 100% on the information written on any SDS

We cannot say a given product is toxic without knowing the exact concentration and the required environment for its use.

Robs products are just as dangerous as any other in their category and I'm sure those are formulated to not put you at risk at any given moment.

The toxic warnings written on those papers are most of the time law requirements that surpass the ridiculousness of the world we live in. As mentioned by Tom, even coffee has to be listed in prop 65.

Most of the ingredients used in those formulations provide the information based on their 100% concentration. We will never use those ingredients in full concentration that would be absurd. For example, the ingredient you want to know more about is usually included at a range of 3% to 7% per weight in a highly concentrated formula. meaning for each 16oz of other ingredients you will find 0.48oz of that ingredient that gets further diluted at an average of 2oz per gallon of water. This greatly reduces such ingredient to 0.0075oz on any given product that includes it. That concentration would not even make sneeze. all this numbers more or less but make the point. I have no intention to use a calculator just for this.

Lets take this example. silly but it helps. Say that you worked 10hrs and did not eat nor drink enough water and I gave you two tequila shots; I assure you, that will put you to sleep or at least make you dizzier than one may believe. Now, if you rested well had enough water through the day and I put those tequila shots in 24oz of margarita mix and I offer you 1 pound of food to eat to accompany that drink, my friend, you will not even notice you had 2 tequila shots. Got it?

I hope you get the point and again no, I did not imply at any moment a given product was toxic but the opposite.

To say that all products are equal in toxicity is misleading. This reminds me of clients that clean their own carpets. They think they know but in realty they are misinformed.