Are truckmounts over engineered these days?

SRD

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Several things go into truckmount design that alot of people dont understand. Cost, government regulation, safety, shutdown sensors that keep a small issue from becoming a large or catastrophic issue. Ive seen alot of things on truckmounts that just didnt make sense to me over the years, but maybe one day someone will build the perfect truckmount
;) @RobAllen
 

SRD

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One of my favorites is the belt shrouds on alot of machines with the sticker that has the pic of a hand going thru the gears, if you need that visual to not put your hand thru a pully you shouldnt be able to turn the key on anything you should just stay in your house and dont go outside like forever.
 

J20770

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One of my favorites is the belt shrouds on alot of machines with the sticker that has the pic of a hand going thru the gears, if you need that visual to not put your hand thru a pully you shouldnt be able to turn the key on anything you should just stay in your house and dont go outside like forever.
All it takes is one idiot or unsupervised child. Just think of all the stupid crap that has been done in order for all the warning labels to be needed.
 

Jim Davisson

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Knowing what I know now, I wouldn't buy a
big 3 manufactured TM over a reliabuilt, Judson or a Dynachem (which has the best self regulating high heat exchanger with zero Fail-Safe devices required). Smart and simple is always best. A big float tank with an engine oil cooler in it is also a must have along with no wiring, relays, solenoids, temperature relief valves, etc... No need for them when done right.
 

john gerding

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This is exactly why I bought and love my Powermatic 2100... Not only can I work on it but I can build it how I want it to be...the simple Open frame with easy axcess to components leaves me with the ability to route hoses and wires how I want.
 

Todd the Cleaner

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Seems many complain about the difficulty to work on their units especially newer models. What do you think a truck now it’s over engineered?
Absolutely
 

Todd the Cleaner

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well heres the thing folks. Its all YOUR fault. YOU asked for more heat. YOU asked for more this, YOU asked for more that. So all they did was try to please everyone.

Its kinda like asking Rob, why do you keep making more presprays? Its because YOU asked for it.
Exactly
 

wandwizard

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I have a love/hate relationship with my overengineered Boxxer. When it's working right I love it, which fortunately for me has been most of the time. When it's not working right I hate it, especially when the thing causing the problem isn't something I'm not smart enough or technical enough to fix! I don't like being forced to rely on places like Jondon to fix what I can't fix and quite frankly, sometimes they can't even fix it either and they're specially trained to do it supposedly. If I were in the market for a new machine right now, especially after what's been happening to me lately, there is no way under the sun that I'd by another heat exchange machine that requires a bunch of sensors, actuators, solenoids, thermal control modules, potentiometers (whatever in the world that is, I just found out mine was supposedly out. Another 100.00 part to add to my bill), as well as 2 extremely difficult to remove and repair heat exchanges just so I can get about 200 to 220 degree heat for cleaning a carpet. Btw, the brand new 100.00 potentiometer made zero difference in the problem so I might as well have shredded a hundred bucks.

Let me say this too. A truck mount that is properly made should last the lifetime of the owner and be able to be repaired to original running condition w/o basically buying the whole thing over again. Ideally, you should be able to fix most problems yourself and buy parts locally and get service locally. If I ever do buy another machine, which is doubtful, those things will be the top priority in any decision I make. I don't know exactly how many thousands of dollars here and hundreds there I've spent to avoid buying another truck mount. I'm realizing a little too late that is exactly what I should've done a long time ago. Before this month is out I will probably have spent another grand on the old Boxxer 421. I would not even consider another TM made by the big manufacturers.
 
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matt30577

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I feel the opposite of what most of your are saying. I'm on my 4th big named tm (everest 650hp) and I wouldn't have it any other way. Yes it's got all the sensors and service engine soon light. It even has a blinking code that tells me where to start if I have a problem. Yes, it had a problem when I first bought it, (o2 sensor on the catalytic convertor). But the engine light told me exactly where to find the problem, and it didn't affect the performance.

Something you guys can't wrap around your head, is most of these big named tm, make their replacement parts in a laser scanned machine that makes each part exactly the same. When I had problems with my stupidtex, he made the parts by hand which made it near impossible to install (exhaust manifold).

Yes, there were a few over engineered machines (prochem performer with the computer screen) But they learned from them.

I'm willing to bet the big named businesses back up their technology and will replace the whole machine if it's a lemon more than a garage tm would ever do. I have experienced both situations and Hydramaster bought out my lemon so I could purchase my Titan that was bulletproof.

Are you guys truckmount mechanics or carpet cleaners?

And if you think a truckmount is too over engineered to work on, just stick with a portable. They aren't that hard to maintain. I hate the new look, but Sapphire truckmounts are really spaced out good to have access to each part. Did you see how the new 870's faceplate folds down? And Hydramaster's lineup is easy access also. The blower might be a little too low to make it a pain for oil changes, but it'll work.

My main point is, who will bail you out if you have a major catastrophe? Big name, or garage man?
 

OxiFreshGuy

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I think the trouble is most of us whatever the FIRST truck mount we use (which is more likely a big 3) you will catalog the negatives in your head and then over time, "Blah such and such company machines are terrible"

Strange how half the Hydramaster guys swear and would die by Hydramaster, and the other half think they are pieces of garbage and would never use them again...oh funny humans...
 

Chris K

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My next TM will probably be a Judson C4 with a LG4 heater. No hot water bypassing and all the sensors and solenoids that come with it. Pump flows nothing but cool water.

I spoke with a nameless person who is a legendary installer/technician around me - he said the computerized TM's are ridiculous. He basically said the big companies have engineers working for them who have to have a place in this world, so they are over-complicating TM's.

You have to remember it's just a motor, blower and a pump... then of course a heat source. Why a computer?
 
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JD5150

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Nine years I have had fuel fired heat machines and there is no way I will go back to heat exchange. Fuel fired is much simpler and will deliver more heat than the biggest over engineered machine. You can bump your flow up and not lose heat with fuel fired. Do that with a medium sized TM you will run it to warm temps

Big three take away max power. They spin the blower slower for longevity. You have a 47 blower belt driven machine but get the performance of a 45 blower machine. Same as 45 machine will give results of a 36 machine and so on.

I can have my air cooled 35hp engine off the frame and reinstalled in 30 minutes. Try that with a over engineered air cooled heat exchange machine :p
 

DakotaG

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Keep in mind with the Juson C4, you get a 500 CFM monster with 250 degree heat that stays 250 even with a 12 flow wand.... all for around 22k.

The machine has 2 electrical wires....
That what u use? Got any pics of ur setup? Love judsons
 

OxiFreshGuy

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We just bought our first truck so our second will probably be a Judson, but my concern is having fuel fired heat with technicians... cant get them to clean a damn upholstery tool lol
 

TWalters

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I'm still on my first machine, a TCS Brave. A smaller unit, but has been very simple to work on. I have had a fair share of problems with it. The pulleys were set up wrong, wrong sizes, etc. But it was simple enough built that I was able to make new pulleys, and have most of the bugs worked out. If something breaks on a job, I can usually find it quick and find a way to make it through. No overly complicated HX, or switches. It's just an engine, blower, and pump. With a little giant propane heater. I'm still not sure whether my next machine will be fuel fired or a HX. I would like not having to always worry about having plenty of propane, exchanging tanks, and being worried about a propane leak. But it is nice not having all of the extra components and expense that all of the Heat exchangers seem to have. But I don't think I would ever want to own a machine that I didn't feel that I could do most of the work myself.
 

Anderson

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both garage build and BIG 3 are good machines.......

but you have to shop around especially garage build.......

my question is can the average carpet cleaner or even an auto mechanic really work on these big......

i have heard good feedback on PROCHEM.....
I feel the opposite of what most of your are saying. I'm on my 4th big named tm (everest 650hp) and I wouldn't have it any other way. Yes it's got all the sensors and service engine soon light. It even has a blinking code that tells me where to start if I have a problem. Yes, it had a problem when I first bought it, (o2 sensor on the catalytic convertor). But the engine light told me exactly where to find the problem, and it didn't affect the performance.

Something you guys can't wrap around your head, is most of these big named tm, make their replacement parts in a laser scanned machine that makes each part exactly the same. When I had problems with my stupidtex, he made the parts by hand which made it near impossible to install (exhaust manifold).

Yes, there were a few over engineered machines (prochem performer with the computer screen) But they learned from them.

I'm willing to bet the big named businesses back up their technology and will replace the whole machine if it's a lemon more than a garage tm would ever do. I have experienced both situations and Hydramaster bought out my lemon so I could purchase my Titan that was bulletproof.

Are you guys truckmount mechanics or carpet cleaners?

And if you think a truckmount is too over engineered to work on, just stick with a portable. They aren't that hard to maintain. I hate the new look, but Sapphire truckmounts are really spaced out good to have access to each part. Did you see how the new 870's faceplate folds down? And Hydramaster's lineup is easy access also. The blower might be a little too low to make it a pain for oil changes, but it'll work.

My main point is, who will bail you out if you have a major catastrophe? Big name, or garage man?
i have heard good feedback from PROCHEM Tm.....
just remeber PROCHEM is no longer in business.....

SO WERE YOU ABLE TO WORK ON THESE PROCHEMS
or was a local auto mechanic able to work on it....

wo taking it to distributer TM mechanic?????

thats the REAL QUESTION???
 

wandwizard

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I feel the opposite of what most of your are saying. I'm on my 4th big named tm (everest 650hp) and I wouldn't have it any other way. Yes it's got all the sensors and service engine soon light. It even has a blinking code that tells me where to start if I have a problem. Yes, it had a problem when I first bought it, (o2 sensor on the catalytic convertor). But the engine light told me exactly where to find the problem, and it didn't affect the performance.

Something you guys can't wrap around your head, is most of these big named tm, make their replacement parts in a laser scanned machine that makes each part exactly the same. When I had problems with my stupidtex, he made the parts by hand which made it near impossible to install (exhaust manifold).

Yes, there were a few over engineered machines (prochem performer with the computer screen) But they learned from them.

I'm willing to bet the big named businesses back up their technology and will replace the whole machine if it's a lemon more than a garage tm would ever do. I have experienced both situations and Hydramaster bought out my lemon so I could purchase my Titan that was bulletproof.

Are you guys truckmount mechanics or carpet cleaners?

And if you think a truckmount is too over engineered to work on, just stick with a portable. They aren't that hard to maintain. I hate the new look, but Sapphire truckmounts are really spaced out good to have access to each part. Did you see how the new 870's faceplate folds down? And Hydramaster's lineup is easy access also. The blower might be a little too low to make it a pain for oil changes, but it'll work.

My main point is, who will bail you out if you have a major catastrophe? Big name, or garage man?
Simply put, most of the big 3 ARE too over engineered for almost ALL carpet cleaners to work on themselves so you MUST rely on service shops to do certain work for you and it absolutely will not be cheap. It's true that sometimes the big 3 put out a really good machine that's been pretty bullet proof like the Titan as well as certain units by Prochem. Still, if you are not fairly near a shop that has the knowledge and expertise to work on some of these units it can be a real pain. Also, when certain problems occur that you can't fix yourself that same shop can sometimes be backed up for weeks before they can get you in so you better have a plan B. I will say again, that over all I've had good service from my machine and it's been really, more reliable than I expected or I would've sold it years ago. I do get tired of buying this that and the other for it, especially proprietary parts which are INSANELY EXPENSIVE.

My advice to the average Joe starting out is to get a machine without all the stuff make heat exchanges do the one thing that they're designed to do, make water hot. That's it, nothing else. We spend 10's of thousands on these machines that are made more unreliable because of this one and only thing. We want FREE hot water, but is it really free? Not in my book. These machines produce vacuum, put out water under pressure and that's about it. The less you have that can go wrong is decidedly a better way to go.
 

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