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Adding an OP

Timothyscarpet

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Chris Westerman
I recently added the Mytee Eco17 to my van with the intent to utilize similar to a 2nd wand on larger commercial jobs and potentially large open residential. Encap has come along way and there is some really impressive chemistry as well as machines out there now. I was feeling limited by my 1 wand TM on some larger commercial jobs but I could not justify selling, trading, or adding another TM (our 370 only has 600 hrs) So the 2500 investment should pay for itself in only a few jobs this year and will definitely boost the production rate on our commercial work.
 

kevinj6121

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Adding another tool to the tool box is never a bad thing The Eco17 is a good machine, I have the orbot vibe, a 15inch CRB a challenger OP a 175 and even the little oreck orbital in addition to my TM.
VLM cleaning has been around for a long time and is/has been growing in popularity for awhile now regardless of what we think.
One can choose to learn it and join in or not, the choice is ours to make individually.
I chose to join in on VLM cleaning and have done various methods and variations of it
When done right both HWE and VLM work, we come across different situations all the time
Personally I like to have more options other then just HWE everything all the time.
Having the equipment I have allows me to get creative sometimes, i can mix and match
Sometimes after doing HWE i'll roll in my vibe or challenger and throw a microfiber or cotton pad and go over everything again real quick, this will pull more moisture and soil out and improve overall appearance some as well as allow faster dry times.
Sometimes I'll VLM with the CRB then use the vibe or challenger to finish up
Sometimes i'll VLM with the CRB then use the TM for a quick rinse and extract..The variations of what i can do are many
I can accommodate what ever the customer wants.
I have one VLM only cleaner in my area that i know of, he gets a good amount of work and i have had people call me and ask if I do low moisture cleaning, If i say no sorry i don't do that and that's what they want then that's a job i would normally lose
but i don't as i can say yes i do that as well as HWE
Once at the customers home ( and i'm only there because i said i do VLM) and i see the carpet and the condition i can then explain the methods without getting to technical and recommend what i think is best for them at that time. 80% of the time they go for HWE the other 20% get some form of VLM
One thing i always try not to do is knock any method, I can't as i do them all.
The VLM only cleaner in my area trashes HWE all the time, he has to, he has no choice i guess.
Whats he suppose to do tell his customers that HWE is actually better but i couldn't afford to by a TM so i do it this way instead
 
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Timothyscarpet

Active Member
Aug 29, 2018
213
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Real Name
Chris Westerman
Adding another tool to the tool box is never a bad thing The Eco17 is a good machine, I have the orbot vibe, a 15inch CRB a challenger OP a 175 and even the little oreck orbital in addition to my TM.
VLM cleaning has been around for a long time and is/has been growing in popularity for awhile now regardless of what we think.
One can choose to learn it and join in or not, the choice is ours to make individually.
I chose to join in on VLM cleaning and have done various methods and variations of it
When done right both HWE and VLM work, we come across different situations all the time
Personally I like to have more options other then just HWE everything all the time.
Having the equipment I have allows me to get creative sometimes, i can mix and match
Sometimes after doing HWE i'll roll in my vibe or challenger and throw a microfiber or cotton pad and go over everything again real quick, this will pull more moisture and soil out and improve overall appearance some as well as allow faster dry times.
Sometimes I'll VLM with the CRB then use the vibe or challenger to finish up
Sometimes i'll VLM with the CRB then use the TM for a quick rinse and extract..The variations of what i can do are many
I can accommodate what ever the customer wants.
I have one VLM only cleaner in my area that i know of, he gets a good amount of work and i have had people call me and ask if I do low moisture cleaning, If i say no sorry i don't do that and that's what they want then that's a job i would normally lose
but i don't as i can say yes i do that as well as HWE
Once at the customers home ( and i'm only there because i said i do VLM) and i see the carpet and the condition i can then explain the methods without getting to technical and recommend what i think is best for them at that time. 80% of the time they go for HWE the other 20% get some form of VLM
One thing i always try not to do is knock any method, I can't as i do them all.
The VLM only cleaner in my area trashes HWE all the time, he has to, he has no choice i guess.
Whats he suppose to do tell his customers that HWE is actually better but i couldn't afford to by a TM so i do it this way instead
I realize now we have built a truck mounted culture with our customer base. Commercial account typically don't care as long as it looks nice and fits the budget. But love what you said about multiple methods on the same job, there is no 1 size fits all approach.
 

kevinj6121

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I own all that i do due to hard work and being good at managing my money, anybody can accomplish the same really if they wanted to.

It has been a truck mounted culture for a very long time now, not so much truck mounted but HWE in general

That is slowly changing though as more and more guys are either adding or totally switching to some form of VLM

So we either "shit or get off the pot" as the saying goes
Now this HWE or VLM thing also depends where your located too
There is only one guy that I know of in my area that is VLM only
But there are like 6 other companies in my area that are HWE only

So the ratio of VLM to HWE cleaners is going to vary depending on where you are
 

mrotto

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when the carpet manufacturers start recommending/specifying VLM is the day I will use it.

So goes the thread about the bad reputation of carpet cleaners. Every owner has different thoughts on how to clean a carpet. Which goes against what the people that actually MAKE the stuff specify in the warranty brochures.
 
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ACP

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Apr 9, 2014
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I recently added the Mytee Eco17 to my van with the intent to utilize similar to a 2nd wand on larger commercial jobs and potentially large open residential. Encap has come along way and there is some really impressive chemistry as well as machines out there now. I was feeling limited by my 1 wand TM on some larger commercial jobs but I could not justify selling, trading, or adding another TM (our 370 only has 600 hrs) So the 2500 investment should pay for itself in only a few jobs this year and will definitely boost the production rate on our commercial work.
It's the only way to roll imo... we save countless hours per week/month doing a mix of encap and TM on big residential.

I do not recommend starting a business all VLM but once you have a strong reputation and your getting into really high end homes using a TM everywhere is not only a liability but it's a full blown waste of time.

We have 2 guys on the job site and almost every job is VLM everywhere upstairs where you can knock out 6-8 mostly clean areas in 45 min or so.

Simultaneously the other guy is hitting the heavy use areas downstairs like the main family room, stairs, etc..... or he's knocking out a steam clean on a few showers.

This is how we crush big tickets in 2hrs and can do multiple per day without working nearly as hard.

Truth is no matter what you think of encap it is so much more enjoyable than sweating your ass off with a wand.
 
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kevinj6121

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I could be wrong but most that start out in this business start out with HWE, at least that's the way its always been in the past.
But nowadays i think a lot more are starting with some form of VLM over HWE then in the past.
But i still believe HWE is in the lead for new guys starting out

The real question is how many guys that started out HWE only, totally gave it up to go VLM and visa versa.

I do both and at least at this point i can't see myself giving up either to do just one method only

I personally like being able to switch it up when a situation calls for it
I also like to do some form of combining methods at times
I'm one of those guys who likes to experiment. I don't ever experiment in a customers home though.

I'll tell ya a true story and you can laugh if you want, I don't care

One day i went to a local carpet store that sells and installs carpet
They always have a dumpster full of carpet that they took out of someones home or business
I went in and asked if I could take some of the old dirty carpet
The guy looked at me like I had three heads or something, it was actually pretty funny seeing the look on his face and his reaction to my request
But once i explained why I wanted to do this he was like sure man, go ahead knock yourself out, just be careful and don't get hurt on our property.
I've done this more then once to try out and compare products, methods, different machines and such. I like experiment and play around, just can't seem to help myself

Maybe this would be something good for new guys to do to get some practice and experience before going into paying customers homes
 
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kevinj6121

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Jun 29, 2014
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Kevin
when the carpet manufacturers start recommending/specifying VLM is the day I will use it.

So goes the thread about the bad reputation of carpet cleaners. Every owner has different thoughts on how to clean a carpet. Which goes against what the people that actually MAKE the stuff specify in the warranty brochures.
Thats all fine and dandy as far as the warranty brochures go, if your in a home and customer has a warranty on there carpet and they bring it up then by all means go ahead and do HWE.
But a large majority of homes we go into or at east i go into the current homeowner is not the original and the carpet that is there was there when they moved in and there is no warranty anyway.
Also when doing a job in an apartment complex most times they are trashed and worn out already anyway and have no warranty either
we all always get jobs when someone is selling their home and just want it cleaned so it looks good when they put it on the market and they could care less about a carpet warranty or how the manufactures recommend it be cleaned.
Or all the people that call to have their carpets cleaned before the move into a new place
Honestly, in all the years i've been cleaning carpets, and i started back in the 80's after i got out of the Army.
I've never once, even till this day ever have had a customer bring up or even be concerned or mention anything about the warranty on the carpet
I do have some high end expensive home developments in my area that i clean in, i've yet to run into any trashed out carpets in any of those homes, those are the jobs i like the best because the carpets are always in good shape to begin with and they always get HWE anyway unless they specify they want a low moisture type cleaning
 
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Timothyscarpet

Active Member
Aug 29, 2018
213
62
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Real Name
Chris Westerman
I could be wrong but most that start out in this business start out with HWE, at least that's the way its always been in the past.
But nowadays i think a lot more are starting with some form of VLM over HWE then in the past.
But i still believe HWE is in the lead for new guys starting out

The real question is how many guys that started out HWE only, totally gave it up to go VLM and visa versa.

I do both and at least at this point i can't see myself giving up either to do just one method only

I personally like being able to switch it up when a situation calls for it
I also like to do some form of combining methods at times
I'm one of those guys who likes to experiment. I don't ever experiment in a customers home though.

I'll tell ya a true story and you can laugh if you want, I don't care

One day i went to a local carpet store that sells and installs carpet
They always have a dumpster full of carpet that they took out of someones home or business
I went in and asked if I could take some of the old dirty carpet
The guy looked at me like I had three heads or something, it was actually pretty funny seeing the look on his face and his reaction to my request
But once i explained why I wanted to do this he was like sure man, go ahead knock yourself out, just be careful and don't get hurt on our property.
I've done this more then once to try out and compare products, methods, different machines and such. I like experiment and play around, just can't seem to help myself

Maybe this would be something good for new guys to do to get some practice and experience before going into paying customers homes
I've done that for practice stain removal and carpet dying.
 

Timothyscarpet

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Aug 29, 2018
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Chris Westerman
All I know for sure at this point is the Eco 17 is 1 BA machine! And when in the market for TM if you buy new....buy 1 size bigger than you think you will need!! I bought a new 370SS, just hit 600 hrs since I got it last April and I wish I had the 570. But with the depreciation on it its worth more to keep it as of now. Seems there is a sweet spot for selling used TMs and I've got to put quite a few more hours on mine before I'd even consider selling. By that point I might just add a 2nd larger unit.
 

kevinj6121

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Kevin
All I know for sure at this point is the Eco 17 is 1 BA machine! And when in the market for TM if you buy new....buy 1 size bigger than you think you will need!! I bought a new 370SS, just hit 600 hrs since I got it last April and I wish I had the 570. But with the depreciation on it its worth more to keep it as of now. Seems there is a sweet spot for selling used TMs and I've got to put quite a few more hours on mine before I'd even consider selling. By that point I might just add a 2nd larger unit.
I bought my TM new as well i got the boxxer 318 with a 36blower i originally wanted a judson but was told at the time there would be a 3 month wait, i didn't want to wait. I am happy with it though. I was using the MYtee escape ETM just prior and this is definitely a lot better, i do mostly residential and most of my hose runs are 100 foot or less once in awhile i use 125 foot and on a few occasions
2 to be exact in the last year went I up to 150 feet with no problem at all. So it fits my needs just fine.
And to be honest I notice no difference in performance between when i use 100 ft or 150 ft. But yeah you do take a pretty good loss when you try to sell one as everyone wants to lowball ya.
so i'll be keeping mine for awhile too. But my next one will be a Judson
 

george8585

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I bought a Trinity Phoenix for commercial carpet cleaning

Resized_20210220_132228.jpg
 
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george8585

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Adding another tool to the tool box is never a bad thing The Eco17 is a good machine, I have the orbot vibe, a 15inch CRB a challenger OP a 175 and even the little oreck orbital in addition to my TM.
VLM cleaning has been around for a long time and is/has been growing in popularity for awhile now regardless of what we think.
One can choose to learn it and join in or not, the choice is ours to make individually.
I chose to join in on VLM cleaning and have done various methods and variations of it
When done right both HWE and VLM work, we come across different situations all the time
Personally I like to have more options other then just HWE everything all the time.
Having the equipment I have allows me to get creative sometimes, i can mix and match
Sometimes after doing HWE i'll roll in my vibe or challenger and throw a microfiber or cotton pad and go over everything again real quick, this will pull more moisture and soil out and improve overall appearance some as well as allow faster dry times.
Sometimes I'll VLM with the CRB then use the vibe or challenger to finish up
Sometimes i'll VLM with the CRB then use the TM for a quick rinse and extract..The variations of what i can do are many
I can accommodate what ever the customer wants.
I have one VLM only cleaner in my area that i know of, he gets a good amount of work and i have had people call me and ask if I do low moisture cleaning, If i say no sorry i don't do that and that's what they want then that's a job i would normally lose
but i don't as i can say yes i do that as well as HWE
Once at the customers home ( and i'm only there because i said i do VLM) and i see the carpet and the condition i can then explain the methods without getting to technical and recommend what i think is best for them at that time. 80% of the time they go for HWE the other 20% get some form of VLM
One thing i always try not to do is knock any method, I can't as i do them all.
The VLM only cleaner in my area trashes HWE all the time, he has to, he has no choice i guess.
Whats he suppose to do tell his customers that HWE is actually better but i couldn't afford to by a TM so i do it this way instead
I have a Challenger too. Used it today. I like it for small houses. I use a CRB first then Challenger to extract.

Do you like your Challenger ?
 

Timothyscarpet

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Aug 29, 2018
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Chris Westerman
I think the important thing to note as well with vlm is it depends on the integrity of whose performing the clean, sloppy HWE jobs are not superior to a well executed VLM clean.
 

kevinj6121

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I have a Challenger too. Used it today. I like it for small houses. I use a CRB first then Challenger to extract.

Do you like your Challenger ?
I've only used it a few times as i just recently purchased it but yes I do like it.
I did just as you did, CRB 1st then challenger to extract
If i'm not going to use the CRB 1st i'll use my orbot vibe as it has an onboard spray system
 

mrotto

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Thats all fine and dandy as far as the warranty brochures go, if your in a home and customer has a warranty on there carpet and they bring it up then by all means go ahead and do HWE.
your missing the point. Its not a warranty issue.

Look, the people that MAKE carpet have done all the testing of all the methods and know how they all work. THEY have made the determination that HWE works best. In fact THEY are so convinced that they REQUIRE HWE to maintain their products.

So I dont give a rats *ss about warrantys. Who knows carpet inside out and upside down. The people that MAKE it. Wouldnt it be prudent to follow what they say?

And watch all the posts about VLM. They start out with *Im tired of dragging hoses* or *Ive had it with my TM* so just because its faster or they dont like HWE (or not doing it correctly) they have determined whats best for the carpet.

Yes you can *whip out* carpet with VLM but does it produce the best results let alone keep the carpet clean longer? Nada.

VLM as a maintenance method for commercial installations of which it was designed, yes.
 
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mrotto

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and Rob asks why this industry has a bad name. Everyone has their own opinion and thinks they know best. Think about that.
 
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Timothyscarpet

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Chris Westerman
I'm never hwe commercial glue down again! I hwe this carpet last June and it never looked this good, chair mat marks used to be my worst enemy, the eco 17 tore right through them!
IMG_20210220_214929_644.jpg
 
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george8585

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I'm never hwe commercial glue down again! I hwe this carpet last June and it never looked this good, chair mat marks used to be my worst enemy, the eco 17 tore right through them!
View attachment 95907
Beautiful !!!

What encap are you using ?

Looks like microfiber with scrub strips bonnet. I never use cotton on commercial anymore. Microfiber works best on commercial.

I love VLM !!!
 
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Timothyscarpet

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Chris Westerman
Beautiful !!!

What encap are you using ?

Looks like microfiber with scrub strips bonnet. I never use cotton on commercial anymore. Microfiber works best on commercial.

I love VLM !!!
Release it Punch prespray, rinsing with either ds2 or hydrox, their line up is stellar from what I've tried, and yes micro fiber scrub bonnet.