Hardwood Floor

Discussion in 'Hard Surface Care' started by Joseph Rogers, Feb 21, 2012.

  1. Joseph Rogers

    Joseph Rogers Premium VIP

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    What kind of equipment is used to completely re-finish Hardwood Floors? What finishes are used to make them pretty when you're doing it?

    I've seen a little top-scrub and re-coat system that Bridgepoint has, but beyond that, I don't have a whole lot of ideas.
  2. Tron

    Tron Well-Known Member

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    There are two major differences in refinishing hardwood. There's guys advertising it now with a sand less solution, I don't know exactly what they are using and I'm sure it shines it up well and takes out light scratches and stuff. But a real refinish requires you sand off all top coats down to the prime wood floor, then stain and then seal. Huge messy undertaking but is worth big $ of you can do it correctly. If you screw it up you'll loose your butt.

    I'll offer the new ways bridgepoint and others now have, but I'm not getting into real refinishing, it's really an art.
  3. Steve Toburen

    Steve Toburen Strategies for Success

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    I'm always looking for new ways to diversify, Joseph. But I'd approach full HW refinishing with caution. I recently had my study, kitchen and dining room oak floors sanded and refinished. The total bid was like 650.00 including the materials. (I only got one price as this fellow came recommended.) They made four separate trips and probably had close to 20 man hours tied up in the job. Do the math ... :)

    Steve Toburen
    www.SFS.JonDon.com

    PS That being said, I am in love with the concept of cleaning and maintaining your customer's hardwood floors. And I'm hearing really good things about a machine called the Dirt Dragon and the related lines of chemicals and finishes that come with it. Anyone have any experience with this system?
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  4. LFC

    LFC Premium VIP

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    I've just come back from a Chemspec training course (less than an hour ago) for the sand less method. To say I was disappointed would be an understatement, in fact quite a few guys walked out. The floor had lost not only its shine, but its colour in quite a large area, and all they did was re-apply the shine. The floor still looked bloody awful only this time it looked bloody awful with a nice shine.

    It seems this system is only good as long as the floor is in pretty good condition. Yeah' you can fix minor blemishes and gauges and it does give a good shine, but if the floor is worn forget it.
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  5. Steve Toburen

    Steve Toburen Strategies for Success

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    This goes along exactly with the reports I'm getting from the field. Even more so than with the textile cleaning we all know and love "pre-qualifying" and setting the customer's expectations are essential with hardwood "renovation". (In other words- know when to walk away!)

    Steve Toburen
    www.SFS.JonDon.com

    PS One reason I love hardwood floor renovation is it fits in great with the pre-paid Stay Beautiful maintenance program concept! I've got all the details on the Stay Beautiful program in this free download. Just mentally change the words "carpet cleaning" to "hardwood floor cleaning" as you read. :)
  6. Richard Baldwin

    Richard Baldwin Premium VIP

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    The Bridgepoint system is for maintenance. It is not a refinishing. You scrub down the wood finish and apply two coats on top to help seal and restore the shine. It does help to remedy very minor scratches but not the major scratches. If the floor has a discoloration problem it has nothing to do with this system, and if the customer is concerned about that, then the clean and polish method is not the right choice. I'm surprised the "instructors" didnt figure that out when they looked at the demo floor.

    I have always been curious about doing real refinishing on hardwood floors, I think it would be a really good business in my area, but there is no way I'd do three rooms for $650.00. More like $3000.00 and in my area I would get that IF I did good work in a timely manner. The key would be in the know-how. How to sand the floor without leaving gouges, how to prep and clean properly, what products to use when re-laquering and so forth. Not sure if there are any courses on it but I'd take em if they did.

    Here is how I do the Bridgepoint system:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_QAGethcRk&list=PLA10205BBA4181CDE&index=57&feature=plpp_video

    And for a real refinishing I found this fairly informative video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=LpCzDMR1LCs


    I also found this vid, which makes me wonder, could this be done with a Cimex?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=LpCzDMR1LCs
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  7. Joseph Rogers

    Joseph Rogers Premium VIP

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    That's what I'm shoutin'. I'd love some hands-on kind of knowledge. If there WAS a class (hint to [MENTION=479]Steve Toburen[/MENTION] and [MENTION=116]Scott W[/MENTION].), then I would take it. I have always thought wood to be beautiful, and would (pun not intended) like to work with it.
  8. Steve Toburen

    Steve Toburen Strategies for Success

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    The sanding/refinishing of wood floors is a very specialized niche, Joseph and at the current time you'll probably need to go outside of Jon-Don or BP to enter it. BUT at the SFS seminar we do demo the Dirt Dragon and the Betco line of wood floor renovation products and teach you how to set up a Stay Beautiful program using these tools. So your prayers have been answered! :)

    Steve Toburen
    www.SFS.JonDon.com

    PS BTW, Joseph, you are in good company when you focus on wood floors. Last summer Big Billy Yeadon blogged about Shaw's new emphasis on hard surface flooring ...
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  9. LFC

    LFC Premium VIP

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    If its the Bridgepoint system you want to work with you can pick up all the information you need off a disc, believe me it's not Rocket science. Get in touch with Scott and he will send you one. I have it and it is explained very well there really was no need for me to take this course I thought (hoped) I was going to learn something about worn or discoloured areas.
  10. Tron

    Tron Well-Known Member

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    It's like a strange long winded echo in here...


    Sand less over the counter wood products are just like a Murphy oil soap on steroids.
    If you sell it as refinishing you have now become a wood hack.

    Refinishing is a huge detailed undertaking thy has no relatability to cleaning.
    The crews we hire to finish hardwood we sell do only that, they have 5 guys full time with trailers full of machines specifically for it, and spend days to do it and do it right.

    Not something you just "get into"
  11. Scott W

    Scott W Preferred Vendor Premium VIP

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    I will be glad to send a disc with training for the Bridgepoint Wood system. Just send me an email. As stated above, it is a maintenance product and not meant for floors that are really worn.

    I have worked with the Dirt Devil System. It is a good cleaner. The real key is the finish you apply after the floor is clean. Basic has an easy refinisher that is just to keep up the shine. It is rather easy to use. They also have a finish that is thicker and takes more training and practice to apply evenly.

    BTW - There will be a demo of the Dirt Dragon and Basic coatings at ProLine in Sacramento on Friday. I will be their for an event this weekend and doing a short leather cleaning class.
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  12. crash1big

    crash1big Well-Known Member

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    Hardwood floors aren't what they used to be. Now with the advent of aluminum oxide finishes ( prefinished floors); there are a whole new set of circumstances to deal with. There is pretty good money to be made in refinishing but you need to know your stuff. Age, thickness, wood types, trowel filling problems, etc. To have good equipment ; you'll need to spend some money. Somewhere between 9-15k. The computerized versions run in the 10-15k range. The drum sanders you can rent just won't do. The edging sander takes some time to learn too. Also the darker the color the easier it is to see imperfections. The going rate around here is 2.50 - 4.00 per foot.
    It would be ideal to get with someone who does unfinished wood and hang out. Could learn quite a bit. :)
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  13. Chiquillo

    Chiquillo Member

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    That's tottally correct Tron / From all the different services / Carpet / upholstery / Rug Cleaning / Auto Detail.
    The last One I want to mess with, With very low knowledge and Just a CD / to say I'm ready.
    Don't think so.

    One of my best friends back in L.A / He has over or close to 20years Exp. has worked by himself for the last 10years.
    Has work I will say with One of the best Hardwood floor companies back in L.A

    And belive me it takes a lot of skills / knowledge / & time to get all the right tools you need. Just the main Sander / is over $6000dls
    Try a weekend as a helper / for a local guy, or friend that you have in your area. Ride along with him. And see for your self all the different task & techniques they apply for this job.

    I worked for almost 3 years, for a couple of Co. back in SOuth Bay / L.A
    I stay with what I'm good at / Carpet-Upholstery & Auto Detail!!!!
  14. Chiquillo

    Chiquillo Member

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    Be ready to Move a lot of Furniture Back & forward [ no braking is aloud!!!!! ]
    cover all the expensive stuff / close with 6mil Plastic areas were you don't want your coustomers to be bother by the dust
    New machines with the dust free service. So your floor buffers & Edgers will work together with Dust Vacuum
    To carry all your tools at once. A cargo Van at least. Solo is a killer to do. A helper is a must also. Some knowledge better / $10, $12dls an Hour for a Helper??

    I will consider all this, That you can do it. Yes you can. But that is as easy to do, by just following a DVD / Not quite sure!!!
  15. Steve Toburen

    Steve Toburen Strategies for Success

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    The new finishes are incredibly hard and just don't wear like the old stuff. BUT these floors still get DIRTY and people will stiff cough up good money to "renovate" them. I don't sell equipment at Jon-Don (don't even really know what we carry) but I'm fascinated by the possibilities of wood floors.

    Steve Toburen
    www.SFS.JonDon.com

    PS To illustrate my point at last week's SFS in Atlanta I asked how many people in class offered wood floor cleaning? One student raised his hand. Then I asked, "How many of you see more hardwood than carpets nowadays in your high end homes?" Every single hand went up. Think on that ...
  16. Joseph Rogers

    Joseph Rogers Premium VIP

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    Yeah, I actually got that disc a couple years ago when I was working for another company. Nice "stay pretty" system, but I don't want to really get into it, unless I can work the same miracles that I can on carpet. Would you go in and clean trashed college apartments if you only had a wand?
  17. LFC

    LFC Premium VIP

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    This is the floor they tried to teach us on, and then tried to tell us we would get $2200 for it. Not a cat in hells chance. This floor needed a professional sander.


    ignore this its the wrong picture and it won't upload the correct one.

    Attached Files:

  18. LFC

    LFC Premium VIP

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    Then you need to take a really good course and be prepared to spend a few bob.
  19. Chiquillo

    Chiquillo Member

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    is just an Asumption!! you can not go, by just what a few guys say. It is how you see your businees in your Area. From a city, to another city. could be a lot of difference.

    Know a days, as there are alot of Carpet Cleaners. is the same for Hardwood flooring. Is like if a Hardwood floor guy, Know wants to do Carpet Cleaning as well.

    you developed your skills & knowledge with just a single class? how much took you. to be in the level you are right know?
    I send a text mesage to my firend, asking him for his Work Pict. I'll post them later. So you can see, how hard is to say
    I'm a Pro Hardwood floor guy!!!!
  20. LFC

    LFC Premium VIP

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    As long as the floor doesn't need sanding then there's no harm and you will be surprised by the results. However, if the floor is lets say trashed in carpet cleaning terms then you would have to walk away.

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