Fuel regulator probs

Discussion in 'Power Clean' started by AAA, Jan 26, 2011.

  1.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    I have 2004 Powerclean 5.9 with a Nissan motor - unit kept shutting down after a few seconds after starting. At times it would run longer, I thought it was the electric fuel pump so I switched it. But I notice still there is no fuel coming out of the return lines back to the tank. So i checked and there is no fuel coming out of the fuel regulator. Where can I find a regulator for this engine? It is a Zenith fuel injection. Is there an after market or car substitute?
  2.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Wow, this sounds like the same problem I am having! Have you found any type of fix for it? I am so frustrated with my genesis! The fuel pump runs only when it wants to. I thought it was an over heating problem but with an added cooling fan still no luck. The machine will shut off anytime of the day, even minutes into the first job. With the turn of the key I can sometimes hear the fuel pump turn on, other times no sound. Any thoughts?
  3.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    Frogs I know the feeling, I have replaced fuel pumps, CPU, regulator, it would seem to work for a bit then it would act up again, SUPER frustrating and there is no one in my area who works on these units. In my case after spending all that money was to disconnect the fuel pump from the cpu power and wire it directly to the ignition switch, so for the past 4 months since doing that I have had 0 probs and that solution cost me $0. The power supply from the cpu would be intermittent, so that led me to believe it was the cpu failing (could be one of the other sensors (oil pressure, overheat) that is triggering the cpu) but after changing the cpu it would still act up, so I tried power from the ignition switch. Give this a try FIRST before spending all the money I have.

    Let me know if that helps, if not I have a few other ideas, I do feel your frustration. When it runs it runs great but it is a fairly complex unit with way to many solenoids and controls.

    DAve

    If you do decide to replace any parts related to the Zenith System call that number for Zenith they were very helpful, and 1/3 the cost of my local Prochem dealer. Prochem used the same system on the units of the same years.
  4.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Thanks for the info. I have replaced the wiring harness but that hasn't solved the problem either. My mechanic has loaned me a couple used CPU's and I'm getting by with switching those around when the engine shuts off. I just mailed my CPU to Zenith so that they can tell me whether mines bad or not.

    I've run the fuel pump to the battery and no luck there, plus the pump would run non stop. I ran the machine hard for two days last week with no problems. Today it is back to the same symptoms. I will try your suggestion on hooking it up to the ignition switch. I'll just need to figure out which terminal to connect to. I think there is perhaps 5 terminals. I'll post the outcome soon.....wish me luck!
  5.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    My fuel issues began again this week, with a my fuel pump failing (it was 3yrs old) could not find the same model as that so I got another one only to have my old issues return, stumbling on load, dieing right out, etc. Thought it was air, bled the fuel system, ran better, but would die in 5 min. Then after switching around all my spare parts, I came to realize that I needed a pump with a MINIMUM pump pressure of 10 psi, the one I had bought was 5.9-9.5 psi. So went and bought another fuel pump 10-15 psi and it ran perfect. After testing around the shop for 20 minutes under load I thought it was fine to send back out, after 30 minutes it just shut off. grrrrrr and would not restart, and as per murphy's law I literally had 6 more wand passes. So I found the front top 30 amp fuse had blown, and found a bare rub spot on that wire near the fuse block. So went and changed fuse and it finished the job, but that was friday and we sent the other trucks out till I can confirm this one is reliable again. Such a pain sometimes. Think I will just stick to my drive shaft units in the future. I have 2 new slide ins (06) and one 1996 drive shaft unit (cleanco) and the drive shaft has given me 0 probs.

    Keep me informed maybe between the two of us or other owners of these nightmares may join us here; we can keep things going long enough to to afford a big enough hole in the ground that we can bury them. :)

    DAve
  6.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Ha, yes I big hole in the ground seems to be a perfect solution! Last week I sent my PC to Zenith and they found that it had zero codes on it and no factory settings, basically it was a blank PC. They told my mechanic it was as if it had been struck by a power surge. Anyhow....they re-programmed it and I installed it this past Saturday back into my Genesis. It ran perfect for the entire job which took about 3 hours. I will withhold my excitement until another couple weeks go by with no problems. I'll keep you posted!

    I am also on a search for a proper fuel pump because I think I have a weak PSI pump installed.
  7.  
    Gman

    Gman Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    527
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Occupation:
    MakingMoney
    Location:
    WI
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    Real Name:
    Johnny B L
    Business Location:
    United States
    This was posted below on your other thread:

    It could be your wastetank shutoff solenoid going bad. Its telling the carb sensor not to inject fuel into the carb because it thinks the wastetank is full.
    Quick temp fix ........ In front of the carb is the sensor find the hotwire and run it to a toggle switch then the other toggle wire to the + on the battery. Its already grounded so flip the toggle to on and fire it up.. It will start..
    When you have time replace the wastetank solenoid then rewire it back like it was.

    Looks like you gotr runnin. :D
  8.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    Okay mine is still down, if yours keeps running I will drive down and drop mine off to you for spare parts save me from digging that hole. Checked the grounds they were loose, did not fix the prob, checked all wires looked good, did by pass the waste tank just in case it was faulty but no luck. Have thought about going to a carb they are $241 but just sooooo sick of fooling with this unit and spending gobs of money on it. When it runs it runs great but I just wait for the phone call from the crews telling me it died again.
    Hope yours keeps going let me know.
  9.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Gman,
    The shut off valve for the waste tank has long since been disconnected, never worked in the first place. But I do still have problems, read below...

    AAA,

    After the PC was reprogrammed it ran perfect for just under two weeks. However, today with no warning at all it went back to the same symptoms, only worse! Besides the fuel pump not getting power most of the time from the PC, the governor is making a rapid ticking sound. I'm told that their is an internal butterfly valve that will stick and not allow fuel to pass and that their is also a magnet inside that can break apart, ugh!! I can get the engine turned over only for it to sputter and spit black smoke from unburned fuel.

    I also have thought about the carb conversion kit. I just don't know anyone local that wants to attempt it.
  10.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    I was hoping you had her fixed, mine has been down for 2 weeks I can not even bear to deal with right now I have enough spare trucks I don't need it right now. Only real prob with carb kit I figured out is it has no governor - so it would need a electronic one or a cruise control hooked up and that is beyond me. Carb would install easy but the rest I don't care to tangle with. Once I am back from holidays I will begin again tinkering but it sooo unreliable now and a money pit my guys think I should scrap might buy a diesel Kubato and drop it in, who knows cheaper then a new unit.
  11.  
    Gman

    Gman Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    527
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Occupation:
    MakingMoney
    Location:
    WI
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    Real Name:
    Johnny B L
    Business Location:
    United States
    Any luck yet guys? Man, cause that sure is a tough one to troubleshoot! :eek:
  12.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    No luck at all - sad I am thinking of scrapping it seems like a shame with less than 5ooo hrs on it but have spent sooo much time and money and it is sooo unreliable and unpredictable. You change one thing and it may run for an hour or two weeks then it acts all up, I am a pretty handy shade tree mechanic but I am stumped. Wondering if any one has converted one of these to carb and an electronic govenor - I don't care to experiment any more if some one has not tried it before. Currently looking at another TM to replace and call it a lesson learnt only buy from a local dealer who can work on the unit no matter how handy you may think you are!
  13.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Ok guys, I sent my ECU back to zenith and upon further testing they found that the ECU was overheating and causing specific programs to overheat. For my ECU it was shutting off the fuel pump and fuel injector power. The overheating started around 150 degrees. I have a brand new ECU now and it has run perfectly for three hard, hot days. I also plan to keep the secondary radiator fan blowing through the van and over the machine. I also intend to extend the wiring harness so that I can mount the ECU under the seats where it will be even cooler.
  14.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    Who was the person you were dealing at Zenith? What you said makes alot of sense. Keep me informed Geoffrey as to how it runs over the next few weeks. Either here or you can email at dave@aaasteamcarpetcleaning Hope this solves this.
  15.  
    kelly m

    kelly m New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2009
    Messages:
    287
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Truck Mount Mechanic
    Location:
    Utah
    Ratings:
    +20 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Kelly McCloy
    Business Location:
    United States
    lol...i was going to write something ignorant and insulting...but instead let me give you my telephone number....just in case you would like some help...there is a certian way to diagnos an engine that has fuel injection...zenith is no differant from any other single injector...throttle body system....except ...you have to know where to start...and what steps to take. if you would like some help..i would be willing to assist you with your problem...i am a certified power clean mechanic...i am very well versed with fuel injection...and i actually am certified by gm...nissan...subaru...toyota...and also....the old bosch systems...that are mechanical...lol...ive repaired the zenith fuel systems on other machines aswell...blueline...steam action...lol ace...so heres my number...801 599 5330...feel free to call...of course if you werent from tmf....good luck
  16.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    Thanks Kelly I will be giving you a call any help would be appreciated - what is the best time to call?
  17.  
    Todd the Cleaner

    Todd the Cleaner Super Moderator Staff Member Moderator Premium VIP

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2011
    Messages:
    13,241
    Likes Received:
    4,737
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Owner / Operator
    Location:
    Pahrump, Nevada, United States
    Ratings:
    +11,741 / 26 / -0
    Real Name:
    Todd Cottino
    Business Location:
    United States
    I have worked on several truckmounts with a fuel injected nissan or zenith engine. The fuel injection system has been full of problems clear back to 2005. 9 out of 10 times it is computer related. If possible I suggest switching to a carb. I did on my truckmount and have not had a fuel problem for 5 years now.
  18.  
    Frogs Floor Care

    Frogs Floor Care Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Occupation:
    Owner/operator
    Location:
    Florida
    Ratings:
    +27 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Geoffrey Odermatt
    Business Location:
    United States
    Todd, where and what parts did you get for the carb conversion? After a good stretch of good running my unit is shutting down again. This time stalling after no more than 10 seconds of run time.
  19.  
    AAA

    AAA New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Dave Hahn
    Business Location:
    United States
    Hey Geoffrey

    I was wondering how you have been making out? After sending in my CPU to be tested (it was fine), checking and rechecking all wiring changing fuel pumps. I finally believe I have found my prob. It has been running fine now for a couple hundred hrs. It was the fuel pump the Zenith system requires quite a lot of pressure to properly operate. I had noticed that when I started having probs way back that I could not see much or any fuel by passing back to the fuel tank. So I changed the fuel regulator but no change I changed pumps and doubled up on the pumps. But in the end the pump was too low. So the it would run fine for a bit but when it required more pressure it could not get it from the pump the engine would start to lean out, and make it run warm which would trigger an over heat code in the CPU and it would shut dw. So now with this new high pressure pump lots of fuel is by passing now to the tank.
  20.  
    TruckmountPro

    TruckmountPro New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    11
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Location:
    Arizona
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Real Name:
    Clint Morrill
    Business Location:
    United States
    Changing for F.I. to carb is illegal, mandated by the EPA. Don't get caught doing this or you will be fined. Any Equipment running 900cc's or more had to F.I. to pass regulations. Manufactures had to comply, not for more sales, its what they had to do.

Share This Page