A Nasty Rug I'm Cleaning Off Site

[Jason Whaley]

Lady called today for a rug cleaning. She told me she tried to clean herself and left outside to dry then it rained on it. Smells like mildew and colors ran as seen by photos. Red on the pattern and blue onto the fringe.

How would you handle this rug?

If you are going to say pit wash that is OK but also explain how you would handle it with a TM only cleaning.


I was planing on vacuuming very well the clean both sides with the TM and use blowers to dry. Next I was going to use microban to try and rid of the odor.

I told her the bleeding may not be able to be corrected but I would try. What would you do to try and correct the bleeding?

[Rug Washer]

Jason,
If you want to really get into this E mail me your phone number.

[leofry]

share some info please if you do decide to clean

[Jason Whaley]

Bump-ty Do......

[sbsscn]

not to ure about the bleeding but id try this:

Dry vacuum (dry soil removal) both sides
Rug badger it
apply a color stabilizer or anti souring agent
Use encapsulator
re vacuum
Hot water extract it
rinse with encapsulator like Pros choice SCR...or sumtin like that
dry and revacum
apply a deodorant like formula 210

see what happens

[Rob Allen]

Jason I would first get them to sign a waiver in their own words.
Then I would test my cleaning chemical by using a grin test.
Apply dye blocker if necessary.
Pit wash or truck mount clean.
I would clean with something neutral and synergistic with citrus solve if I want to boost it.
Hang dry or float it

But I probably would wait on Lisa before you proceed for prior bleeding. But I have made friends with a local Armenian guy who can repair anything when it comes to area rugs including re-coloring.

[Jason Whaley]

Thanks for the suggestions so far.... I will be cleaning it on Saturday at my home. The lady basically just wants it cleaned and deodorized but I wanted to play with it since I had the whole day. I didn't over deliver on results and she is not expecting a miracle. Although I know someone here could perform one!

Keep suggestions coming!

[Jason Whaley]

Well, I'm done..... I used a high Ph cleaner (after testing) to clean this rug. I used a rotary to prescrub the prespray on both sides. Next I used the TM at 200o F and 400 PSI. After cleaning I used Brigepoint's Spice air to deodorize. 10oz to 1 gallon of water for each side. Blowers to dry.



I played with some bleach mixed 15 to 1 to try and rid the blue dye on the fringe. For the most part it worked!




Before...




After...

[LisaWagner]

You do realize that surface cleaning does not take care of the contaminants INSIDE this rug due to the original improper cleaning? Odor is a sign of something growing inside the cotton foundations fibers, those warps and wefts.

This is the biggest warning I give for anyone handling flood exposed rugs - and improper cleaning qualifies as a textile with improper water exposure.

You cannot thoroughly decontaminate a rug with surface cleaning with a truckmount or portable. These rugs need to be soaked and cleaned.

I know the "pit" is inconvenient to you, and to the client - but to actually clean the piece, meaning it is safe to go into the home, you are doing a disservice by cleaning it topically and not thoroughly.

Anyone else with this situation - if you cannot do a real cleaning - then recommend a rug plant. Even if you cannot get an industry rate, you need to do what is best for the rug and the clients in the home where the rug is being placed. There are so many potential dangers here with this scenario... and if it were a sewage order, you truly could expose yourself to dangers if the household became ill from a rug that you deemed as "clean."

Oriental, hand woven, wool rugs, need to be washed. This post truly is no different than the ChemDry video that everyone posts is a shock ... and I'm sorry to hammer on this like this, but I've seen too many instances of irreversible damage, and unexpected risks, from rugs being improperly cleaned. Just because it looks better does not mean it is clean. And those fibers still have residue in them - they are matted and have "bed head."

If this was synthetic - it's another story - you can blast it with heat and keep it wetter, longer, not worrying about the dyes bleeding.

Wool rugs, you need to handle it very differently. And if cleaners out there are too against doing pit washing or pouring a floor because it's inconvenient or expensive, then you are out there making the bad reputation that this industry has because you are cutting corners on "clean" for the sake of "convenience."

If you do not love rugs - and won't do what needs to be done - then please stop taking rugs in. There are plenty out there who know and want to do what is right for the rug and the client.

Truck mount rug cleaning is NOT for wool rugs.

If surface cleaning is the only method you are able to learn - then at least use a Steamin Demon, at least there is rinsing that is serious.

Sorry for being *****y on this thread... I'm just surprised to see people post here talking about steam cleaning this rug that is clearly contaminated. Have any of you taken WRT - do you know what's possibly in these rugs after long term exposure to soil and water?

Lisa

[Jason Whaley]

Thanks for the response Lisa.... Now I feel like I need a spanking! LOL


I see where you are coming from but she was not going to pay to have it done the right way anyway so I feel I returned the rug in better condition than when I received it. Cleaner, odor free, less noticeable bleeding and staining.

She got me down to .875 a square foot for both side and deodorizer 10 X 8 X 2 sides = 160 sq. feet, including pick-up and delivery. Would you have touched this rug with your process for that little of $$? I doubt it and I doubt anyone else would either! Some people just are not going to spend $1.00, $2.00 and so on to have a rug cleaned the right way. Yes I do have a rug dealer that I refer high end rugs to this just wasn't the case here.

By the way I did not guarantee anything other than the odor to be removed. That is all she wanted!

[Rug Washer]

Lisa I don't think anyone is listening......do you???????????

[LisaWagner]

Jason, I really don't want you to take this personally, because I know some of this board (even some who run this board) fall into the same trap you have right here... and I hope that unlike Ron's comment that "no one is listening" (thanks Ron by the way...) - that you will consider a few of the things I bring up here. Actually, with as many untrained rug cleaners who come to this board, my hope is that several will understand what I'm saying here.

First of all - if a customer is dictating and negotiating down YOUR price, you might as well close your doors. This is YOUR business, YOUR rules, and YOUR prices. YOU are the expert - or should be - not them.

And as the expert, who truly knows the BEST way to clean - best for the items and best for the home environment - it is your responsibility to explain why certain methods need to take place, what the pros/cons are, and what the price is - the set price.

If someone refuses to pay, you turn down the job. Because doing a half-ass job because someone does not want a proper cleaning should be something that ethically you should never want to do. You are a professional cleaner... not an errand boy for an ignorant rug owner.

It may be, that if you flipped that rug over, and explained to her that this is a hand woven rug, with every single knot on that rug tied BY HAND, and that it likely took several weavers more than a year of their lives to weave this... that she may have had an increased sense of value for the piece - I find most rug owners have no idea how a rug is made, and that this is a piece of someone's life on their floor.

It may be, that if you explained that BEFORE this wash her rug was worth several thousand dollars (not anymore) - that she would want to attempt to have it properly washed and try to return some of its value back.

It may be, that if you explained that the odor is a sign of microbial growth inside the fibers of this rug, and that surface cleaning with a deodorizer might mask it, but the icky stuff will still be inside and potentially lead to mildew and dry rot and odor in the future - that she might have had you do the right thing.

No one FORCES you to lower your price and your standards - YOU make that decision.

My prices are not negotiable. I lay out the costs and set my prices to a fair rate and a fair profit for an excellent, thorough cleaning. No one in my shop cuts corners, and no customers of mine force corners to be cut.

You are the professional here, not her.

You made a little money, maybe a little profit (you probably broke even in time and supplies) - but you lost credibility with that customer, who will always know that she can work your price down in the future on other items, and that she has the power to say how to clean, and what to pay.

And you are not alone in that customer trap - MANY others do the same thing, trying to make any sale even at the expense of their own expertise.

Sacrificing the quality of the cleaning for the sake of convenience is not the quality of a pro. A pro knows what is best, sells what is best, and ends up attracting the best clients.

Everyone reading this... if you really believe you know what is best, and feel your prices are fair, don't ever negotiate. Speak your suggestions, and your price, with confidence... and then keep quiet and wait for the answer. Don't backpedal. Just know with confidence that you are worth every penny.

If that client would have come to me, I would have sold her at $4 per sq ft, and $100 for a sanitizing soak, and $50 each end to debleed the fringe - and I would have gotten it, and the rug would have turned out beautifully.

People need to respect their oriental rugs, and the professionals who clean them. Otherwise, these are not clients to have.

Jason - next time opt to subcontract to a plant, tack on $1 per sq ft for profit to you, and see what happens - if you really believe that is the best way for the client, they will say yes... you'll make more money that this order, and for no work besides transport, AND you will see the incredible difference a proper wash does for wool rugs that you will never be able to do surface cleaning with your truckmount.

Just consider it. Please. You deserve to be making more money than this... and your customers deserve better cleaning.

Lisa

[the rugman]

Interesting post! I agree with Lisa - BUT - times are a little tough out there. I have been offering people a few incentives - free pick up and 10% off if they pre-pay the order. This way they get some savings but I am not dropping my prices per-say. It does help - especially if people are on the fence about cleaning or maybe getting more rugs cleaned at once.

[leofry]

Lisa I am hearing you loud and clear... I am not where you are but I am trying to drive that way... so keep talking .. dont stop e

[rjfdube]

Jason; I would invest in a large kids pool; and do some hands on training for rug cleaning asap if you intend to take on these jobs. Lisa and above experts are correct in their recommendations. Take it from someone that had a $50,000.00 Hand Knot made Turkest Rug literally fall apart while cleaning it in the custy's home. Thank God for Insurance; 24 years ago next month that happened; at the time I was working for a major chain cleaner and the tech in charge had as little or less of a clue than I did at the time. Just my 2 cents; btw I have seen a lot of guys use large kids pools for pits; cut a hole i one side and use styrofoam to fashion a plug.

[Jason Whaley]

No problem Lisa... I didn't take it personal. I have put off the rug class for years and I need to get my a$$ out there and take it!

Question... Can I just build a 12 X 12 square structure and line it with heavy mill plastic to clean these rugs then use a water claw to extract followed by blowers to dry? Would this be an acceptable process in your opinion?

[tom676]

Jason I built mine using 4 inch PVC pipe from Lowes make it any size you want just get the 10 foot lengths of pipe and couplers and 90's pick up a heavy duty tarp to over lap the edges fill with water and float your rugs and your done. Just disassemble when your done.

[LisaWagner]

Here is a post with some other ways to get a wash pit inexpensively. Jason - I hope this helps for the next time. Sorry for getting up in arms over this one... I've just seen cleaners take a hit when they cut corners and return a contaminated rug back to a client. Of course, I live in California, where consumers are trained to attack businesses.


Lisa

[sam miller]

ya California that explains alot LOL. just kidding it really is that way here.

[Jason Whaley]

Here is a post with some other ways to get a wash pit inexpensively. Jason - I hope this helps for the next time. Sorry for getting up in arms over this one... I've just seen cleaners take a hit when they cut corners and return a contaminated rug back to a client. Of course, I live in California, where consumers are trained to attack businesses.


Lisa

Thanks for being honest.... I know I get pissed to when I hear of CC'ers using household products from WalMart to clean carpets and upholstery. I want to learn from the best and "I KNOW" you are one of them!

Keep it real!